Ace-Garageguy Posted December 17, 2021 Share Posted December 17, 2021 I fell in love with the Pennsy T1 the first time I saw one, and still think it's one of the most beautiful machines yet made by humans. The streamlining was designed by Raymond Loewy, same guy who did the '53 Studebaker and the Avanti, so there's a definite car tie-in here. Sadly, none of the original 50+ remain, having all been cut up for scrap. But there's a group of enthusiasts who have set out to build a NEW one, from the ground up. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobraman Posted December 17, 2021 Share Posted December 17, 2021 What a monster that engine is. Shame none are left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobraman Posted December 17, 2021 Share Posted December 17, 2021 Nice to see that there are still some folks around that can do that type of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Van Posted December 17, 2021 Share Posted December 17, 2021 I have been following the 'T1 Trust' from the start. My late father in law was a PRR man. His brother was in charge of the PRR S-1 (look that monster up!) While it is great that these guys are building a locomotive I LOVE.....they can not build it exactly like the original. It will be a tribute loco as they say. We no longer have the ability to cast the frame for this loco, they are welding it up from stock. It's one of those 'technology lost' things. The real loco was a bit of a hot rod too. Designed to haul 15 passenger cars at 100mph without working hard.....it took veteran engineers to handle the T-1. It was easy to spin the drivers! I am the owner of 4 PRR T-1 locos....2 each in O3r and HO scale. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake45 Posted December 17, 2021 Share Posted December 17, 2021 And here I thought pulling a P-47 off the bottom of a lake or a P-38 from the bowels of a glacier after 50 years and restoring them to flight were big jobs. At least those guys had something to START with! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CabDriver Posted December 17, 2021 Share Posted December 17, 2021 I was really hoping, from the thread title, that YOU were building one from scratch Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted December 19, 2021 Author Share Posted December 19, 2021 On 12/17/2021 at 2:07 PM, Dave Van said: I have been following the 'T1 Trust' from the start. My late father in law was a PRR man. His brother was in charge of the PRR S-1 (look that monster up!) While it is great that these guys are building a locomotive I LOVE.....they can not build it exactly like the original. It will be a tribute loco as they say. We no longer have the ability to cast the frame for this loco, they are welding it up from stock. It's one of those 'technology lost' things. The real loco was a bit of a hot rod too. Designed to haul 15 passenger cars at 100mph without working hard.....it took veteran engineers to handle the T-1. It was easy to spin the drivers! I am the owner of 4 PRR T-1 locos....2 each in O3r and HO scale. Fascinating real-life connection to the PRR, sir. That road, the NYC and the B&O were all my favorites as a kid growing up in the Midwest and the Northeast. And yes, the S1 is incredible. I'd like to model it someday...but who knows. I have a very old virgin Penn Line HO T1 kit; kinda primitive by today's standards, but should respond well to some intense upgrading and detailing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted December 19, 2021 Author Share Posted December 19, 2021 On 12/17/2021 at 3:55 PM, Snake45 said: And here I thought pulling a P-47 off the bottom of a lake or a P-38 from the bowels of a glacier after 50 years and restoring them to flight were big jobs. At least those guys had something to START with! At least they have lotsa blueprints. But of course, things like the ability to cast a huge steel frame no longer exist in the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted December 19, 2021 Author Share Posted December 19, 2021 On 12/17/2021 at 5:22 PM, CabDriver said: I was really hoping, from the thread title, that YOU were building one from scratch Bill My new shop's not that big, and my youthful dream of owning a big enough foundry to cast a locomotive frame just never worked out. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Van Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Ace-Garageguy said: Fascinating real-life connection to the PRR, sir. That road, the NYC and the B&O were all my favorites as a kid growing up in the Midwest and the Northeast. And yes, the S1 is incredible. I'd like to model it someday...but who knows. I have a very old virgin Penn Line HO T1 kit; kinda primitive by today's standards, but should respond well to some intense upgrading and detailing. My father in law bought me the then Bowser PRR T-1 HO kit back before any were available mass market. It's a decent if simple kit....pulll a ton!!! My O3r PRR S-1.....thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Ambrose Posted December 27, 2021 Share Posted December 27, 2021 On 12/19/2021 at 1:53 PM, Ace-Garageguy said: My new shop's not that big, and my youthful dream of owning a big enough foundry to cast a locomotive frame just never worked out. The video talked about welding up the frame. Given modern welding technology, that makes a lot of sense. As for beauty, I think my personal favorite is still the SP 4449, though this one is definitely in the elite class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugatti Fan Posted December 27, 2021 Share Posted December 27, 2021 (edited) Those American streamlined monster steam locomotives are certainly something to behold. I understand that some of the non streamlined Big Boys have been preserved. One of our British locos, The Flying Scotsman has toured in many countries including the USA and Australia. I saw a video of the Scotsman running parallel to an Australian steam loco. The Scot was on standard gauge track and the Aussie train was running on wide gauge track. The Flying Scotsman pulls enthusiast trains every now and again in the UK as do other restored locos. The Mallard that holds the world speed record for a steam locomotive is on display in the Railways Museum in York, but does not run any more. Edited December 27, 2021 by Bugatti Fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted December 27, 2021 Author Share Posted December 27, 2021 (edited) 20 hours ago, Dave Ambrose said: The video talked about welding up the frame. Given modern welding technology, that makes a lot of sense. It makes sense primarily because we can no longer cast huge steel locomotive frames. Cast steel...not cast iron. And a steel weldment is a very different animal from a steel casting. Not a problem if the engineering is right, but with today's heavy reliance on CAE, it's a valid question as to whether a CAE program can cope with designing a welded structure that performs in every way equally to a massive casting. Known, empirically-derived data is the basis of every answer you get in CAE, and I wonder how much accurate analytical data regarding massive (and long "obsolete") steel castings is available in the typical CAE environment. But I'm pretty sure the guys building this thing have thought of that. EDIT: If you've ever done any welding, imagine the difficulty of getting full penetration on a section around, let's say, 2" thick. Maybe that'll help to visualize part of the conceptual difference in a large weldment vs. a casting. Interesting reading regarding welding heavy steel: https://www.aisc.org/globalassets/modern-steel/archives/2010/04/2010v04_welding_heavy_steel_full.pdf Edited December 27, 2021 by Ace-Garageguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted December 27, 2021 Author Share Posted December 27, 2021 4 hours ago, Bugatti Fan said: Those American streamlined monster steam locomotives are certainly something to behold. I understand that some of the non streamlined Big Boys have been preserved... One has actually been completely rebuilt to operating condition, and has been touring the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Bacon Posted December 27, 2021 Share Posted December 27, 2021 These guys are following up the first new build steam locomotive in the UK for 70 years (the Tornado) with new Gresley P2 -- the most powerful steam loco ever to run in the UK. The P2 had a difficult start but diesel and electric were just around the corner which meant they were never developed and improved like earlier steam locos (https://www.p2steam.com/design-study/). So they've decided to build a P2 as it would have ended up if it had the kinks ironed out: https://www.p2steam.com/ It isn't cheap... buying two boilers costs $1m. but they are fund-raising very successfully. My uncle and I own half a dozen rivets in the frame somewhere... best, M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugatti Fan Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 Bill, thanks for putting up the Big Boy footage. What an impressive locomotive!I It was interesting to read your comments about a cast steel frame as opposed to a welded fabrication with regard to structural integrity. It would take tremendous stress to fatigue a solid cast steel frame compared to welded box sections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mk11 Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 On 12/27/2021 at 10:33 AM, Bugatti Fan said: ...our British locos... toured in many countries ... Indeed https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-43755611 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugatti Fan Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 Mike, that article made really interesting reading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misterNNL Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 On 12/19/2021 at 4:51 PM, Ace-Garageguy said: At least they have lotsa blueprints. But of course, things like the ability to cast a huge steel frame no longer exist in the US. Wonder if a 3D file guru with access to those blueprints could answer the call here for producing the various parts for interested builders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Van Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 The fact we can no longer cast a T-1 frame is not the issue it sounds like. Advances in metal and welding will make a frame just as good or BETTER than the original. I still think it is sad we are loosing the ability to make things we once mastered...... T-1 photo cause I want to....... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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