Best 60s dragster?

[noname]

I would like to buy a nicely detailed 1960s dragster and was wondering what you guys all thought was the best available kit? I'd like to build one with the front  frame exposed.

Thanks

[Bill_Jobson]

I like the MPC Garlits front engine Wynns Charger. Love the look of the Swamp Rats.

[Craig Irwin]

Lots of changes were made during the 60's, a dragster built in 1960 looks nothing like one built in 1969. What era are you looking for?

 

[noname]

Thanks Bill for your suggestion.

 

Craig, I should have known I was too vague.  The truth is I've not much knowledge on dragsters.  I've read a bit on Gasser and Stockers but basically nothing on dragsters.  I generally like old school drag cars.  So early to mid 60s would be my interest.  I like them raw with just a little sheet metal around the cockpit. I have a Tony Nancy double dragster kit, which should cover the 50s (?).  I'd like to build something a little longer than those 50s rail dragsters.  Not much interest in the later 60s dragsters (I believe) with the body panels covering the front of the frame, enclosed cockpit and the streamline bodies. Hope this helps you help me.  Thanks.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Lots of changes were made during the 60's, a dragster built in 1960 looks nothing like one built in 1969. What era are you looking for?

 

 I have a Tony Nancy double dragster kit, which should cover the 50s (?). 

The 1960s saw extremely rapid evolution of dragsters. The famous "Mooneyes" car was from 1961.

The Tony Nancy Plymouth-powered car that you have (kitted by Revell), is from 1963. Very much different, eh?

                                                                     

In '64, Garlits was winning with this...   

Garlits' '67 car: much longer, no front bodywork...   

 

 

Edited November 1, 2015 by Ace-Garageguy

[noname]

Okay, got ya.  I was thinking about something more like the last two. I know there is a difference but along these lines.  I also realize that a lot of these dragsters with the body panels covering the front like the Garlits dragster above can have the front body work left off as in the last picture.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Garlits' '64 car kitted...just happens to be the first 200mph dragster too...

The later, longer front-engined Wynn's Charger is also available, as Bill Jobson suggested...

Garlits' 1970 car, and the event that would mark the end of front-engined top-fuel dragsters...   

     

Edited November 1, 2015 by Ace-Garageguy

[10thumbs]

Hi Matt, I like these cars a lot too.

FYI, do a Google search and you can find lots of original cars that have been torn down and completely restored with good photo and text documentation.  Really a priceless collection that leaves practically nothing untouched about these cars.

I agree too, getting the proper year is important as the development was intense.  The cars that had the frames completely covered were show cars for sure, but I like the ones you're aiming at and I've figured about 1966/67 is about the sweet spot.  Maximum wheelbase 175" for the open cars, longer and they don't seem to be in perspective, my opinion. 

Good luck.

[10thumbs]

Matt, if you don't mind;

152" wheelbase, 1964

182" wheelbase, 1969

The 2nd car is about a "front wheel and a half" longer.  Everything else basically the same.

[echo]

I'm partial to the kit you have, the Tony Nancy double dragster kit and the '64 Garlits car. They both have all the parts to construct a nice car with a little bit of scratch building.  The  re-released kits the Young American and later Don Garlits cars would probably be closer to what you are looking for in a kit, just cut off or modify them to just have the rear sheet metal body.

My own favorite era for dragsters is '64 - '66.  125" t0 150" frames.  There were two brothers building models featured in the old "Rod & Custom Model Cars" magazine in 1964, the Younts brothers. the magazine did a three issue feature on their build of a state of the art dragster of that time, it is still good reading today. Does anyone on the forum know what happened to the Younts brothers ? Sorry if this got a little off topic here.

Also you might want to look into photo etch wire wheels to replace the kit wheels , a weak point in all dragster kits in my opinion.

                                   Ed

[noname]

Thanks guys. Maybe the new kits like the Young Americans and the Don Garlits would be easier to pick up.  Are they in the mid 60s time period?  Good detailed frame and parts?

 

I like the cars 10thumbs has pictured above. Here are a few favorites borrowed off the net.

I really enjoy the low buck dragsters that have non blown Hemi engines.

I would automatically want to get some after market front wheels. I've noticed the kits ones are crappy. What are the best AF sources for these?  Thanks for your help.

[10thumbs]

Matt, I like the 1st pic especially too.  Looks like the1963 or '64 category judging from the wheelbase, which looks to be the 150 inch range.  Nice car.

Finding PE front wire wheels will be tough.  The guys who have good ones are out of stock.  I checked and had email correspondence just this previous week.  The kit ones are terrible.

[noname]

Okay thanks 10thumbs.  That sucks, I just couldn't use the kit wheels. Are these AF companies planning to restock the dragster front wheels in the near future? 

I wonder if a guy could make his own using kit outer rims with guitar string spokes? 

 

By the way, is the TV Tommy Ivo kit any good?

Edited November 2, 2015 by noname

[Old Coyote]

Okay thanks 10thumbs.  That sucks, I just couldn't use the kit wheels. Are these AF companies planning to restock the dragster front wheels in the near future?

I wonder if a guy could make his own using kit outer rims with guitar string spokes?

 

By the way, is the TV Tommy Ivo kit any good?

Yes sir, the Tommy Ivo kit builds into a nice car ........... see below

Tommy Ivo kit ....... late '60's

Two Much chassis, Altered States shorty body ......... mid '60's

 

Dragmaster from the Revell Attempt I kit .......... early '60's

 

Edited November 2, 2015 by Old Coyote

[Bernard Kron]

I guess I've messed with all the generally available kits. Here are my comments on them and some examples of what I've done with them.

Revell Tony Nancy Double Dragster Kit:

The classic with an awesome array of parts. The only downside is that both engines, while beautifully turned out, are oddball as far as the vast majority of 60's FED's are concerned : Buick Nailhead and Plymouth Wedgehead. Also, it's an early 60's release when the wheelbases were still quite short. When I was a kid, in order to keep up with the rapidly lengthening wheelbases I actually combined both chasis from the kit to get a proper length for what was showing up in the magazines! Other than that virtually all the other details are very nicely turned out and, as I said, it's the ultimate parts kit. The front wheels are the best plastic wires out there IMHO. Very importantly, in my view, the three-point roll cage is the proper Kent Fuller style. The 2 chassis are each done in two halves, which some people find fiddly to line up, but I have never considered this much of an issue. At least the tubes are round! Recently re-issued and generally available.

My only survivor from my misspent youth, a stretched double dragster:

AMT Double Dragster Kit

Another classic rich in parts. Also an incredible time piece because the digger chassis pre-dates the Kent Fuller revolution and is a very nice Chassis Research 4-point style with a straight tube front axle. Super nice small block Chevies and 392 Chrysler to work from. Probably the ultimate kit to do very early 60's dragster from. The 2nd "dragster" isn't a digger but a Fiat Altered. Re-issued by Round2 and generally available. The Tin Box special edition is the one to buy because of the extra chrome tree which gets you well on your way to building additional cars from the kit. I got 3 diggers and an altered from one Tin Box!

4 in 1!

AMT Don Garlits  Wynn's Jammer

Another great classic kit full of super-nice parts. Well engineered and accurate 2 piece chassis with posable front end. Probably the nicest front axle out there. The only negative in my view is the Garlits-specific 3-point roll ncage which is long and shallow and pretty unique to him. Hard to use it to build other campaigners from the period. On the other hand the Dodge-branded 392 is very fine with a proper set of zoomies and a well detailed fuel system. Another excellent parts kit that builds up into a good early to mid-60's shorter wheelbase digger. Was re-issued as the HemiSphere and the chassis and drivetrain are available in the recently re-issued HippieHemi

The Garlits Chassis done rather idiosyncratically as a Nailhead powered Junior Fueler:

 

Edited November 2, 2015 by Bernard Kron

[High octane]

Thanks guys. Maybe the new kits like the Young Americans and the Don Garlits would be easier to pick up.  Are they in the mid 60s time period?  Good detailed frame and parts?

 

I like the cars 10thumbs has pictured above. Here are a few favorites borrowed off the net.

I really enjoy the low buck dragsters that have non blown Hemi engines.

I would automatically want to get some after market front wheels. I've noticed the kits ones are crappy. What are the best AF sources for these?  Thanks for your help.

Here's a "low buck" gas dragster that I built a few years ago.................................................

[noname]

Thanks guys for your responses.

Old Coyote, nice builds.  The Tommy Ivo kit looks a tad long and a little later than what I was looking for. The Revell attempt kit looks sweet.

Bernard, thanks for your time. I like the last junior dragster. A quick look on Ebay makes the Wynns Jammer seem a hard to find.

High Octane, I like your low buck dragster. The unsung hero of drag racing.

[Ace-Garageguy]

... A quick look on Ebay makes the Wynns Jammer seem a hard to find.

Here's two for ten bucks each...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AMT-ERTL-DON-GARLITS-WYNNS-JAMMER-1-25-scale-model-kit-/181916293229?hash=item2a5b0e586d:g:5pcAAOSw37tWB4mZ

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AMT-NHRA-Don-Garlits-Wynns-Jammer-1-25-/141812518341?hash=item2104af4dc5:g:7soAAOSwYHxWG~Xm

Edited November 3, 2015 by Ace-Garageguy

[noname]

Thanks for pointing that out Ace.  I did not see that when I last looked. Unfortunately this person only ships to the US. I will keep my eye out. I take it these have been out of production for a while?

So as Bernard pointed out, the Hemi Sphere and Hippie Hemi would be good alternatives for building mid 60s dragsters?

Edited November 3, 2015 by noname

[High octane]

This is a mid-60's dragster that I built awhile ago and was inspired by a photo that I took of the "Beast from the East" that came to race here at Great Lakes Dragaway. I used a Tommy Ivo dragster for the basis of this build.

[noname]

Wow, did something like that really exist?  I would think the tires were too wide for mid 60s.  And I wonder if they were that long at that time?  I'm thinking shorter?

[Bernard Kron]

This is Part 2 of my summary of generally available FED kits that can be used to be build 50's and 60's era dragster about length of wheelbases has come up. I agree that as FEDs evolved into the very late 60's and early 70's the lengthening of the chassis to help stabilize them under initial acceleration really compromised the way they looked. I think it's one reason full ,bodywork became so popular - it helped balance the proportions. 183"-200"+ rails without a nose piece can look very awkward.

There are two mid to late 60's chassis that are generally available in kit form. Both have versions of them that have been recently re-issued.

AMT/MPC long wheelbase chassis - Tommy Ivo, Digger Cuda, Too Much, Young American, etc.

The longer of the 2 is the AMT kit that I believe has its origins in the Tommy Ivo FED dragster. The 1:1 chassis was originally built by Don Long who was known for his (ironically) long wheelbase chassis with a rather upright and close-coupled driver's compartment. The very long wheelbase examples posted above are virtually all based on this chassis. Commonly available recent re-issues using it include the Tommy Ivo kit, the various MPC Round2 re-issues such as the Young American, the Don Garlits Wynns Charger, and earlier re-issues such as the TooMuch double engine dragster from Model King and the Digger Cuda. They all can be readily identified because they use a later 426 Hemi "elephant motor" (or 2 in the case of the Too Much) which can be frustrating if you want to use this chassis to build a 392-based car. Modeler's appreciate the fact that it has a one-piece chassis but the downside is that the frame tubes are half-round with the flat part facing inward so as not be visible (or hidden under bodywork). It is well detailed and easy to build but, as has been already noted above just Too Long for mid-60's rails.

Here are some kit examples:

I have found that an easy approach to getting a proper mid-60's "vibe" out of this kit is to shorten the wheelbase by removing two bays just in front of the motor bay (in the single engine versions) which brings to wheelbase in front about 185 scale inches to about 153 scale inches. Difference in appearance is dramatic and very pleasing to my eyes. I also take the time to file the frame tubes to a round section which, surprisingly, doesn't take that long to do. Another approach is to scratch build a new front end using round styrene rod, generally from the firewall forward.

Here are three models I built using this frame, the first one full length (the appearance of which I find awkward), and two with the shortened wheelbase described above:

Edited November 3, 2015 by Bernard Kron

[dodgefever]

I like the cars 10thumbs has pictured above. Here are a few favorites borrowed off the net.

Brutal.  The '65 - '66 fuelers had the best proportions to my eye.  Once they got into longer wheelbases and high tails they lost something.

Edited November 3, 2015 by dodgefever

[noname]

I agree dodgefever.

Bernard, thanks for your addition to the available dragster kits. Nice builds by the way. You obviously speak from experience. I especially like the striped middle photo.

So I could always get a newer kit as you mentioned above and shorten it.  Or maybe the Hippie Hemi or HemiSphere would bean option if I can't get my hands on the older shoter '64) Wynn's Jammer.

 

 

[Bernard Kron]

Part 2 (cont.)

MPC American Graffiti/Ramchargers FED

The other more evolved FED chassis available for mid 60's work is the MPC Ramchargers FED kit. Also issued as the American Graffitti kit and the AMT. Until very recently these were all sought after collector kits which could be quite expensive to purchase. The American Graffiti kit in particular, as you can imagine, frequently trades in triple figures. The Ramchargers kit, however, is commonly available and can be had for around $30.00 on eBay including shipping. But the really good ,news is that the Jawbreaker has just been re-issued by AMT so the chassis and running gear, at least, are assured of decent ,supply. Unfortunately the really nice clean and simple bodywork of the Ramchargers kit is exclusive to that release. The American Graffiti kit has its own unique Tom Hanna style body which, happily, can be ordered from Altered States Models, along with the simple "shorty" body that you see above on various AMT Tommy Ivo long wheelbase chassis.

The chassis and running gear is the best out there IMHO. It's a two piece affair with round tubing, and clocks in at about 160 scale inches so it's on the money for a mid-60's build. The only annoyance is that the afforably priced Ramchargers and new Jawbreaker versions have an odd-ball center steer arrangement, but I have found that easy to convert to the classis side-steer arrangement. The other unusual thing about it is that it's a "legs-under" design, referring to the fact that the driver's legs are positioned under the rear axle, which accounts for the car's dramatic ultra-low stance. It's an excellent candidate for building a replica of the Surfers digger. Again we're stuck with the 426 elephant motor...

The kits:

 

I've used this kit to build both full bodied and open frame versions and love its low sleek stance and dead-on proportions.

Edited November 12, 2015 by Bernard Kron