yellowsportwagon Posted December 23, 2018 Posted December 23, 2018 27 minutes ago, DoctorLarry said: Test fitted to the body. Front chassis hoop is too tall so it looks like more fabrication. I will probably just whack all of the tubing off and start from scratch. The rest of it doesn't look too bad, though. Larry sometimes it’s easier to leave the body and chassis together and rough work the bars into it. Then disassemble it to do the finish up stuff. I do know when I did my HB car it was a ton of work to get it all fit together.
DoctorLarry Posted December 23, 2018 Author Posted December 23, 2018 Sounds like a plan. When did Nascar engine builders go to dry sump oiling systems?
yellowsportwagon Posted December 23, 2018 Posted December 23, 2018 (edited) Late sixties Boss 9s and Chrysler hemis. Top teams used them first. I took a stab at it and figured HB had a dry sump. I used the oil pan from the TBird kit on a Revell 68 Firebird 400 engine. The engine fit the chassis like it was actually meant to be there. I would say by mid seventies all the cars were dry sump. Remember Herb Adams had a few connections inside GM ? Edited December 23, 2018 by yellowsportwagon Add
DoctorLarry Posted December 23, 2018 Author Posted December 23, 2018 These guys were also all GM engineers so I bet they knew a few things about car design! Did you plumb the dry sump on the HB car?
yellowsportwagon Posted December 23, 2018 Posted December 23, 2018 9 hours ago, DoctorLarry said: These guys were also all GM engineers so I bet they knew a few things about car design! Did you plumb the dry sump on the HB car? No my eyesight doesn’t cooperate that well.
swede70 Posted December 24, 2018 Posted December 24, 2018 Probably already know to you, but this I found nice and agreeably detailed. See: http://www.tachrev.com/GrandAm1973Nascar.htm
DoctorLarry Posted December 25, 2018 Author Posted December 25, 2018 Know the site well. I have had two real Drand Ams. I had a 73 2 door and I currently own a 73 4 door sport sedan. I also have the original article that Horst references.
DoctorLarry Posted December 25, 2018 Author Posted December 25, 2018 Make that Grand Ams. Stubby fingers and small keyboard.
DoctorLarry Posted January 2, 2019 Author Posted January 2, 2019 Christmas break from school means some time to tinker. I'm making slow progress. I have re-done the chassis and cage about 4 times and it looks like I'm going to have to drop the front frame section. This is a 66 GTO frame and pans, Elliot Thunderbird front clip and fuel cell and a scrap Cannonball Run chassis for the rest. All of the rear floor pans, tunnel and truck arm mounts are scratch built. Rear suspension from the T Bird. Scratch built front oil tank, dual remote oil filters and braided hoses. The body is one of my resins but after looking at the pictures of the real car I need way more flare on the wheel openings so a mushed resin 73 Chevelle I bought on EBAY will donate its wheel flares (and its gas opening). Rear spoiler is a resin 73 Firebird one cut down and re-shaped. Seat is from a Buick Regal, I think.
DoctorLarry Posted January 2, 2019 Author Posted January 2, 2019 Popped the wheel flares off my donor Chevelle and grafted them on. First coat of putty.
yellowsportwagon Posted January 3, 2019 Posted January 3, 2019 I sent him an email waiting for a response. Look how much different the engine callouts on the hood are between the high bank picture and the others. Also no naca ducts on the high bank picture.
DoctorLarry Posted January 3, 2019 Author Posted January 3, 2019 In the Motor Trend article on the car, they pointed out that NASCAR was suspicious of the NACA ducts because they were different than the cowl induction setups that everyone else used. That may account for the blockoffs on the high bank picture.
swede70 Posted January 14, 2019 Posted January 14, 2019 (edited) Greetings, Looking around at my period magazines and searching for stuff to call out or identify, at the very least I can call your attention to a particular title and issue if you don't already have such in hand. The May 1973 issue of Stock Car Racing apparently caught the debut of the effort even if the race report of the Winston Western 500/Riverside contest is dominated by event winner Mark Donohue in the Penske Matador. Given reference to the Grand Am effort you are doing is short, I'll relate the paragraph to you here in full: ...A new team showed up and was warmly greeted by the road racing set. Jerry Thompson of Clawson, Michigan, often suspected of fielding a backdoor General Motors entry in the Trans-Am, showed up with a Pontiac Grand-Am and a couple of Pontiac engineer types. They had the usual trouble new teams experience getting through NASCAR's very tough technical inspection, qualified fastest on the second day, and motored around to finish 15th overall. Undoubtedly the crew's inexperience held Thompson back in his NASCAR debut. On its first pit stop the crew got the back wheels up before they stopped spinning, causing considerably delay. Later they had to put out a carburetor fire during a brake-changing and engine-tuning session in the pits... As race reports go, this is a long article and hence there was much else going on that drowned out whatever further attention might have been paid to the fledgling outfit. Hope this helps! Oh - also see this color image via the new Petersen Publishing Archive. Scan down a bit and you'll see it towards the left bottom: https://archive.petersen.org/pages/search.php?search=riverside+winston+western+500+1973&k=&modal=&display=xlthumbs&order_by=relevance&offset=0&per_page=48&archive=&sort=DESC&restypes=1%2C3&recentdaylimit=&foredit=&go=next&offset=48 Mike K./Swede70 Edited January 16, 2019 by swede70
disabled modeler Posted January 14, 2019 Posted January 14, 2019 On 12/25/2018 at 11:08 AM, DoctorLarry said: Know the site well. I have had two real Drand Ams. I had a 73 2 door and I currently own a 73 4 door sport sedan. I also have the original article that Horst references. Nice Larry..! We owned some nice Ponchos once...id love to build replicas of them someday...hope. 73 Grand Am 76 Can Am 75 TA 67,69,70,71,72,85 Grand Prix 63,64,68,69,70,72 Bonnevilles 64,68,69,70,72 Bonneville/safari wagons 70,74 GTO 70/71? Ventura/Sprint
DoctorLarry Posted January 15, 2019 Author Posted January 15, 2019 Ordered a copy of the article and saw the Petersen picture. Took a picture of it. Thanks for the heads up.
swede70 Posted January 15, 2019 Posted January 15, 2019 Good - glad to help in some small way. For searching the same PP archive, a long series of '73 Daytona 500 images turn up, while one has the topic shown nearly face on whilst on the banking. It's in color, and while efforts to link you to a particular image via a URL haven't really translated to value, search '1973 NASCAR' or perhaps '1973 Daytona' and I'm confident you will find it. Thanks... Mike K./Swede70
DoctorLarry Posted January 15, 2019 Author Posted January 15, 2019 I saw it and took a picture of it as well. Great shot.
DoctorLarry Posted January 16, 2019 Author Posted January 16, 2019 Making slow progress. Totally re-did the front frame. Scratch built the tubing and shock mounts. Mounted the radiator, oil cooler and radiator puke tank, which I scratch built. Scratch built remote oil filters to match the real car. Wired the brake lines to a junction block. I will install the master cylinder later. Engine has plug wires and FireBall Models Holley. Dry sump holes are in the pan and after I plumb the carb I will add the pulleys, fan and dry sump pump. I will then connect all of the oil lines and move on to the dash. Interior has a photo etch harness, which was the most difficult and time consuming thing I've ever done. Window net is eighth inch ribbon and gauze padding unrolled.Cage is mostly scratch built. Now on to body, finish the firewall, add brake and fuel lines, and dash.
swede70 Posted January 16, 2019 Posted January 16, 2019 (edited) Looks great - very agreeable progress right across the chassis. Looking forward to more then... Oh - and as usual and after the fact, here would be some close-in pictures of the remote filter mount sporting the pair of filters. Locally I was afforded the opportunity to pour over the Herb Adams Gray Ghost ''71 Trans Am '64 Tempest before it was restored, hence the both the photos and their implied relevance. I have a pair of projects going in relation to the 'Ghost in differing scales, although just in the moment, I thought I could plug in these images should they be of value to you. Mike K./Swede70 Edited January 16, 2019 by swede70
swede70 Posted January 16, 2019 Posted January 16, 2019 (edited) I tried to edit my post seen above to pump up the content. I think I took about 150 Gray Ghost pictures when I was on the scene, hence other detail photographs are at my beck and call if only I sift through them carefully enough. As for the 1:1 car, for quite some time the G.G. was quietly resting in a garage in nearby Brighton, MI., and for some exchange of messages, I was invited out to record everything I could with my digital camera, calipers, etc. Gosh - the fellow even put the 1:1 car on jackstands so that I could further pour over it. A terrific and rare experience this was as I'm sure you'll agree. As to my projects, I worried that it would be tacky to dilute focus from your own work for posting my own stuff on what is your thread. Say 'please' and I could be persuaded to gingerly post some. Mike K./Swede70 Edited January 16, 2019 by swede70
DoctorLarry Posted January 16, 2019 Author Posted January 16, 2019 Please! I would not object at all because I'm sure that similar design thinking went into both cars. Also, on your Javelin post, was that a Mencken book lurking in the background?
DoctorLarry Posted January 16, 2019 Author Posted January 16, 2019 Particularly engine compartment photos.
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