The Pantera WILL have an engine!!

[Dann Tier]

5 minutes ago, vamach1 said:

I assume you have seen the ARII kit.  It has a similar front end.

Sorry, I was confusing....I mean like the one that's on the kit i'm building

[afx]

I think that style air dam/chin spoiler is for the GT5 version.  You can make yourself crazy, ever photo you look it seams there is another variation.

[Dann Tier]

5 hours ago, afx said:

I think that style air dam/chin spoiler is for the GT5 version.  You can make yourself crazy, ever photo you look it seams there is another variation.

sure does, bud!...every variation but the one on the box!

[Sledsel]

13 hours ago, Dann Tier said:

That's pretty sick too!!!!!!

The kit engine is really nice.

[Tommy124]

Hi Dann, great to see you taking on this classic. You are absolutely right in leaving that odd front spoiler. It just does not seem right for any of the many varieties of Pantera cars. Looking forward to see more - count me in!

[afx]

The Group 4 race car had a similar chin spoiler with the corners round off.

[Dann Tier]

8 hours ago, Tommy124 said:

Hi Dann, great to see you taking on this classic. You are absolutely right in leaving that odd front spoiler. It just does not seem right for any of the many varieties of Pantera cars. Looking forward to see more - count me in!

Thanks for following, bud!

[Dann Tier]

7 hours ago, afx said:

The Group 4 race car had a similar chin spoiler with the corners round off.

Nice!....seen them before too, the Muari kit has those....thanks for posting, bud!

[djflyer]

I have the Mauri kit in the psuedo-Cannonball Run boxing. Guess I'll have to check on the tires now.  Its been disappointing that no kits were ever released with a complete driveline. One suggestion I've made to several aftermarket people is an engine compartment kit but no takers (so far).  I'll be very interested to see how you do yours.

If you're still thinking about drivelines, here are some I was considering:

Supercharged Ford V8 - Shelby GT500 or Ford GT

Turbo/supercharged Twin Cam 4-cylinder (yeah I know - no V8 rumble).  Something like the RS200 or out of the Monogram Mustang GTP

A 3- or 4-rotor Wankel - from the Tamiya Mazda 787 or 3D printed (yeah, I already know what you're going to say)

Chevy LS9 - several sources but you would have top get the transaxle

Edited April 23, 2019 by djflyer

[vamach1]

1 hour ago, djflyer said:

I have the Mauri kit in the psuedo-Cannonball Run boxing. Guess I'll have to check on the tires now.  Its been disappointing that no kits were ever released with a complete driveline. One suggestion I've made to several aftermarket people is an engine compartment kit but no takers (so far).  I'll be very interested to see how you do yours.

If you're still thinking about drivelines, here are some I was considering:

Supercharged Ford V8 - Shelby GT500 or Ford GT

Turbo/supercharged Twin Cam 4-cylinder (yeah I know - no V8 rumble).  Something like the RS200 or out of the Monogram Mustang GTP

A 3- or 4-rotor Wankel - from the Tamiya Mazda 787 or 3D printed (yeah, I already know what you're going to say)

Chevy LS9 - several sources but you would have top get the transaxle

No no no to a Chevy or Wankel but it is okay to put a LS into a Delorean. 

[vamach1]

Here's a stock engine compartment.  Not much there except for some cross members and radiator hoses.

[Ace-Garageguy]

1 hour ago, vamach1 said:

Here's a stock engine compartment.  Not much there except for some cross members and radiator hoses.

The "radiator hoses" run to the A/C condenser with the yellow fan. The actual coolant hoses run under the car, as the rad is in front.

The bolt-in crossmember stabilizes the upper control arm and spring-shock coilover attachment locations, and is typically replaced with something beefier on most cars. The chassis on the Pantera is notoriously flexible, the stock part bolts to slotted brackets (visible on the inner fenders here), so the adjustment tends to move around no matter how tight you get the bolts.

Edited April 23, 2019 by Ace-Garageguy

[vamach1]

1 minute ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

The "radiator hoses" run to the A/C condenser with the yellow fan. The actual coolant hoses run under the car, as the rad is in front.

The bolt-in crossmember stabilizes the upper control arm attachment locations, and is typically replaced with something beefier on most cars. The chassis on the Pantera is notoriously flexible, and the stock part has slotted ends which move around no matter how tight you get the bolts.

Thanks for the info.  I could not tell what they were.  I guess you need a/c in a cramped car like that.  Anyway, here's a model with and engine compartment that I just got in the mail today from China.  Well - too bad it's 1/64 scale.

[djflyer]

28 minutes ago, vamach1 said:

Here's a stock engine compartment.  Not much there except for some cross members and radiator hoses.

My suggestion for the engine compartment kit was to have subframe, suspension, inner fenders, and driveline (transaxle at least), and the inner trunk panels.  My feeling was there are enough Pantera enthusiasts to make it viable, especially considering the number of different Pantera kits that have appeared. 

 

[Twokidsnosleep]

Great project, definitely a cool car

Too bad there isn't a kit that adequately shows its internal and external beauty

[Ace-Garageguy]

1 hour ago, djflyer said:

My suggestion for the engine compartment kit was to have subframe, suspension, inner fenders, and driveline (transaxle at least), and the inner trunk panels.  My feeling was there are enough Pantera enthusiasts to make it viable, especially considering the number of different Pantera kits that have appeared. 

 

The Clearly Scale 5-speed ZF gearbox shown earlier appears to have been molded directly from the 1/25 scale unit in the Revell Shelby Series I kit.

I've already researched building a detailed Pantera, and the rear frame section from the same Shelby kit, which includes lower control arms, makes a good starting place.

From the same kit, the rear upper control arms, the front frame section (modified slightly), the front upper control arms and spindles, the rear suspension uprights and halfshafts, the radiator...all look close enough to what's under a real Pantera to be useful if absolute dimensional accuracy isn't the object. Most of the Pantera kits are billed as 1/24, and the Shelby kit is 1/25, so that's an issue.

The rear of the Pantera structure consists of two parallel rectangular longerons (running from the firewall to the rear body panel) that support the engine mounts, rear gearbox mounts, and lower control arm mounts. Their only connection to the body is through the inner fender panels, which have some hat-section stiffening members applied to the undersides where reinforcement is required at the coilover and upper control-arm attachment points.

The rear of the structure is not particularly well engineered from a torsional-rigidity standpoint, and is the reason the real cars twist so much as delivered. Cobbling up acceptable inner fenders from inner fenders salvaged from front-engined models, and a little sheet styrene and bondo, would not be terribly difficult.

There is also a fiberglass trunk liner that drops in over the gearbox, and is retained by twist snaps at the locations of the bright metal receivers around the perimeter of the decklid opening.

Edited April 23, 2019 by Ace-Garageguy

[vamach1]

For those not familar with the Series I here is the instruction sheet.  My kit is missing a few pieces so it may end up as a donor for a Pantera.

[Dann Tier]

Thanks for all the input guys!!…...heres the basic idea I want for the frame/ suspension....

[89AKurt]

6 hours ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

[...] There is also a fiberglass trunk liner that drops in over the gearbox, and is retained by twist snaps at the locations of the bright metal receivers around the perimeter of the decklid opening.

I could see vacuum-forming that part.  Far as building a proper frame, holy cow does Dann have a project by the tail!  Great example of a resto-rod.

[afx]

Very GT40 esque.

[afx]

On 4/22/2019 at 1:16 PM, Dann Tier said:

I have a neighbor that's restoring one......they are VERY underrated!!!! Fujimi makes a plastic kit, AND a rare multi-media kit. If you can find a Tokyo Muari kit, its a VERY nice one too, with opening doors, and lights that work!!, BUT beware or the nice tyres in that kit!!!!...they melt plastic QUICKLY!!!! -even through the plating!!!!   

-Photo 1; Fujimis rare Multi-media kit

-Photo 2 & 4; Current Fujimi kits.....windows are VERY distorted, BUT it is VERY easy to make your own, more realistic ones.  I will be building the Fujimi GTS within a month or two, and I 'm gonna try to fix the kit windscreen..i think I have a great way to save it!!

-Photo 3; This is the Tokyo Muari kit.....VERY NICE!!

The Canon Ball release of the Tokyo Marui/Tilt kit.

Edited April 24, 2019 by afx

[MeatMan]

I've been in love with the Pantera since it came out!

Great build!

[Codi]

Love the chassis / suspension pics you shared Dann and your goal of replicating them.  That will be phenomenal.  cheers, tim

[Ace-Garageguy]

^^^ That car has a custom chassis by The Roadster Shop (the body is a stressed part of the structure in the factory cars, but is just along for the ride on this one), and was intended to run a Windsor-based twin-turbo 428 built by Nelson Racing Engines. The chassis, as shown, is lacking triangulation in critical areas, and due to its design, the engine will have to come out through the interior in the event major work is needed. The engine comes out through the engine bay on the factory cars, as the small crossmember that ties the upper suspension pickup points together is a bolt-in assembly. It's welded permanently as a major structural element in the Chassis Shop frame.

 http://roadstershop.com/galleries/nre-pantera/

 https://engineswapdepot.com/?p=9201

Last I heard, it was for sale in unfinished condition.

EDIT: Yup.  https://www.thedrive.com/tuned-af/17106/theres-an-unfinished-de-tomaso-pantera-project-with-a-twin-turbo-windsor-v-8-for-sale

Edited April 25, 2019 by Ace-Garageguy

[Dann Tier]

On ‎4‎/‎24‎/‎2019 at 7:26 AM, afx said:

The Canon Ball release of the Tokyo Marui/Tilt kit.

Those are the tyres to stay FAAAAAAAR away from!!!!!...unless you use them on metal wheels.....foil wont even stop them from destroying those nice wheels!!!