I'm Allergic to CA and Epoxy

[Bernard Kron]

I've developed a nasty allergic reaction to CA (super glue), and quite possibly epoxy as well. I work a fair amount with resin and occasionally metal and wood. I've been experimenting and have found than in some instances white glue will work OK. In addition, the guys at the LHS recommended Goo, a contact cement made by Walther. I bought some, and whereas its stringy and somewhat hard to handle, it does work quite well. It's acetone based and a sort of a super rubber cement.

Have any of you had similar experiences? Can you make other recommendations for adhesives? In a pinch I can wear my painting respirator, open all the windows, and work quickly and probably get away with using CA, but that''s only in a pinch....

Edited June 13, 2009 by gbk1

[Jantrix]

Wow. Thats some serious bad news pardner. I would try Tenax then.

http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/tnx/tnx101.htm?source=froogle

I haven't used it but as I understand it sort of welds the plastic together, and is non-CA based. It would probably be easy to obtain a peek at an MSDS from the manufacturer Hebco. I know tons of modelers that absolutely swear by this stuff.

I buy this stuff for the kids to use, it does pretty well also.

http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/tes/tes3507c.htm

EDIT- Oh ###### I just re-read the title- non-styrene media. I'm sorry. I don't have an idea for you then.

Edited November 9, 2008 by Jantrix

[Ken Kitchen]

I've developed an alergy to superglue as well. however I have found that for me it's not all types of superglue, just some. What I have been using are the thick glues that come in the little metal tubes that you can buy most anywhere. Other kinds of superglues clog me up like I'm having a hay fever attack, but not these. They're only a buck or so for 1 or 2 tubes. It might be worth a try.

Tenax is great for plastic but as you know it doesn't work on Resin. Good luck.

[Raul_Perez]

Well, you could mail your stuff to a friend in CA right before you come down for the NNL West and ask him to glue a few pieces together AND clear the room of fumes BEFORE you get there!

I hope you find a solution that works!

[Zoom Zoom]

If you want a mild white glue that has nearly the strength of epoxy, try Formula 560 Canopy Glue or the similar Microscale Micro Krystal Klear; they're both thick white glues that are exponentially stronger than Elmer's, and when dry amazingly strong. They both dry (mostly) clear, and are perfect for gluing in glass/lenses/chrome details/emblems and you can wipe up the undried excess with a damp paper towel...not nearly as potentially hazardous to your model's finish as CA glue as well!

I'd be lost w/o my superglue and kicker; my building would slow down a lot if I had to give it up!

[Mike]

Tenax is an available glue. We sell Permatex items at our tool store, and they've got a variety of glues also.

[djway3474]

If all else fails have you tried long rubber gloves and a resperator?

[MikeMc]

Your problem is TIME!!!!!!

The white based glues all will work,but take forever to set up.

Tacky glue or crafters pick water based super glue (Michaels ) are great for glass but will work anywhere

I love them for mock ups....but can work well for final assy

Edited November 30, 2008 by MikeMc

[Bernard Kron]

Thanx everybody. I've been experimenting with various adhesives and am currently building the Replica's & Miniatures '29 A kit which is primarily resin so it's a good test bed.

The Walther's Goo contact cement I mentioned above is the currently top choice as a substitute. It's stringy but it's very strong so you don't need large amounts of it, or even to cover large areas. Spotting along a glue run works pretty well. Also it sets up very quickly and adheres firmly with only slight springy motion within a couple of minutes or less. If you let the Goo set up on both mating surfaces for a couple of minutes and then glue them together, the bond is almost instantaneous. In that sense it may even be superior to CA without a zip-kicker. I'm getting pretty decent at using it so it will have turned out to be a life saver.

Your problem is TIME!!!!!!

The white based glues all will work,but take forever to set up.

Tacky glue or crafters pick water based super glue (Michaels ) are great for glass but will work anywhere

I love them for mock ups....but can work well for final assy

Mike, when it comes to the water based adhesives, your right, the problem is the time they take to create a firm bond. I have been surprised at how strong a bond some of them can provide, especially Craft Pickers "The Ultimate". BTW, your picture looks like my workbench these days! I think Ive tried virtually all the stuff you've got up there.

The bottom line so far is that I'm back up and running. Styrene is a done deal and most resin or multimedia stuff of any size can be handled. I think multimedia scratch building will still be a problem when it comes to very small parts with limited contact area. I have tried using the CA with a respirator on and it works so I can use it in a pinch - it just takes some planning in advance.

Edited December 3, 2008 by gbk1

[Guest Davkin]

Have you tried the foam safe CA glues? I beleive I have developed an allergy to CA and so am looking for alternatives as well. I have read that for some people a switch to foam safe CA glue does the trick. I'm taking a week off from the modeling bench to see how well my sinuses clear up and then I'm going to try the foam safe stuff. I hope it works, I just can't imagine building model cars without CA.

David

[Bernard Kron]

Have you tried the foam safe CA glues?

No I haven't. My reaction to CA is scary enough that I haven't considered variants. I'm recovering nicely from my last bout but it's taken several weeks so I don't want to repeat that again! I'm not sure I know what you're referring to. I think I may have seen something like that in my local RR modeling shop but I'm not sure. Please keep us posted on your results!

Edited December 3, 2008 by gbk1

[Guest Davkin]

There are several brands but here's one of them,

http://www3.omnimodels.com/cgi-bin/woi0001...PMR6072&P=7

This stuff is very popular with the R/C airplane guys that have problems with CA allergies. With how severe your reaction is I don't blame you for not taking the chance to try it.

For me the reaction was just that my allergies kicked into overdrive. I spent a lot of time at the modeling bench over the long weekend and my sinus allergies were much worse than normal and I was making heavy use of CA, but I was also using a lot of Ambroid ProWeld, which like most other liquid cements has MEK as the active ingredient which is very toxic. I may be becoming more sensitive to toxins in general.....getting old sucks. Liker I said, I'm taking a week off from CA and other toxic modeling chemicals to see what happens. I have another project to play with that only requires white glue and acrylic paint, I may be be doing more of that type of modeling in the future.

David

[Guest Davkin]

I tried two different foam-safe CA brands the last few days. I first tried the Zap odorless. It was rather pricey, especially since you had to use special accelerator and that cost even more than the glue. The CA didn't have an odor but the accelerator did, kind of an odd citrusy smell. I wasn't impressed with the performance. It took a lot longer to set up even with the accelerator and wasn't very strong but I didn't seem to have an allergic reaction to it. Then I tried the generic label stuff, you know the kind that most every hobby shop has with their name on it but all the labels look the same. This was the "Super Gold" formula 100% foam safe. This stuff only cost a little more than the regular CA and it worked with the regular accelerator and it worked as good as regular CA, however it does seem to give off some fumes but I didn't seem to have an allergic reaction to it. My allergies to CA appear to be relatively mild though so for someone else they may not help. I know if my reactions were as extreme as yours gbk I wouldn't take the chance, but this information might be helpful for someone else.

David

[Bernard Kron]

It's been six months since the last replies on this topic. Thanx to everyone for their suggestions. I think I may have found the solution for those, like me, who have very bad allergies to CA and can't tolerate even the low odor "Supergold" type CA's. I've tried them all, even going to the point of wearing a respirator and timing my sessions (like less than five minutes).

The real problem isn't so much the initial exposure, but, rather, the gas-off period afterwards. This can be as much as 24 hours long. So any parts I would glue with CA would have to be put away somewhere for a day or so before I could even consider getting near them. An example of how bad this can be was when I did some quick repairs on some models one evening that I was taking to my local model car club meeting (Puget Sound Automotive Modelers Association - PSAMA). I did the work, segregated the cars out in the garage and went to bed. The next day all was fine. I loaded the models into the car and drove out to the meeting. Everything was still OK except I noticed the odor of the CA in my car. But on the way home the gas-off fumes caught up to me and by the end of the hour-long drive I was pretty sick. It was then that I decided that I had to find a way to avoid CA virtually completely.

Up to then I had been using a contact cement like Goo:

It provides a very strong bond but is like its name, stringy and gooey and hard to control. Also, the bond is flexible which isn't what you want in many instances. I still use Goo sometimes for large surface bonding where any residue will be hidden. It is virtually useless for small joints since it's so messy and flexible.

But recently I though I would try Testors Cement for Metal and Wood:

This is indicated for bonding wood to wood, metal to metal and wood to metal. The solvent base is acetone which is pretty harmless and doesn't effect me. Since metal and wood are dissimilar materials I thought it might work with resin to styrene bonds. Bottom line is IT WORKS GREAT!!!! I've tried it on very small joints like spark plug wires inserted in styrene, small resin to styrene joints like mounting resin carburetors to styrene manifolds, metal to styrene joints like metal axles to styrene suspension parts and even styrene to styrene because I think it is kinder to surrounding areas as compared to styrene cement and may actually bond more strongly than a styrene weld in some cases.

It is easy to handle, allows very small amounts to be used while still providing a good bond and is relatively thin so it's not messy. The only downside is that it isn't very tacky and takes a minute or two to set firmly. Since there is no accelerator available for it you have to hold the joint in place or use a pinned joint. Still, for 95+% of those cases where I would use CA it's a very good substitute. I still think there may be a few cases where I will have to resort to CA, but these will be few and far between and I can plan carefully in advance when I have to use it.

I hope this is useful info for those who may have or be developing CA allergies.

Edited June 13, 2009 by gbk1