Moebius Ramp Truck

[slusher]

42 minutes ago, RichCostello said:

I paid over 40 bucks for a kit that is unbuildable. THIS ONE!

I know they are expensive kits, but have you received any parts for yours Rich or any word on the parts?

[RichCostello]

4 hours ago, slusher said:

I know they are expensive kits, but have you received any parts for yours Rich or any word on the parts?

I contacted them about 5 weeks after I first requested replacement parts, and they said that they would send them when they got them, maybe in September. 

Well, it's 3 weeks into September, and still no parts. They won't be seeing any more of my money.

[RichCostello]

4 hours ago, Brian Austin said:

I picked one up at my local shop, and most of the kit seemed fine.  The hood seems to have a slight twist.  I think I could simply glue it to the cab shell if I needed to.  Although I got mine for kitbashing, I would not consider it unbuildable.

Well, mine has a twisted interior floor, a flattened hood, a twisted ramp floor, and a badly warped ramp. I consider it unbuildable!

[iamsuperdan]

7 hours ago, RichCostello said:

Well, mine has a twisted interior floor, a flattened hood, a twisted ramp floor, and a badly warped ramp. I consider it unbuildable!

I received my new hood and floor, but told them my ramp parts were usable, and that I could make it work.

Well, when I got into the build, the parts were much worse than expected. I thought I'd be abandoning this build. But with the right amount of CA glue, and a smattering of NSFW language, I got it assembled, and it looks great. You cannot tell the parts were as bad as they were.

Give it a try, you might be surprised at how well it straightens out!

 

In fact, this build will be in an upcoming issue of MCM.

[1972coronet]

17 hours ago, mikemodeler said:

They can't for the very reason many have stated about the defects in the first place- the kit would be unbuildable. How willing would you be to purchase a kit with it missing key components? It's one thing if optional parts are not there, but the hood and ramp bed? Even at half price it is asking a lot of a buyer to accept something like that.

Thanks much for your perspective. 
My 'idea' of selling-at-a-reduced-price remaining parts has more to do with the spare parts which could be provided; a spare 360/390 and 4-speed and/or C6 trans come to mind.
Certainly, the price of the incomplete kit should reflect this -- does $15- $20 sound unreasonable? Certainly, less expensive than resin ($15-$20 for a complete, styrene Ford FE is worth it alone, IMO, versus paying that much for a comparable resin piece which may require lots of massaging). Then there's extra wheels, hubcaps, bumpers, tail gates, engine compartment components, etc., etc.
Again, less expensive than resin, and certainly more for one's money.

[RichCostello]

3 hours ago, iamsuperdan said:

I received my new hood and floor, but told them my ramp parts were usable, and that I could make it work.

Well, when I got into the build, the parts were much worse than expected. I thought I'd be abandoning this build. But with the right amount of CA glue, and a smattering of NSFW language, I got it assembled, and it looks great. You cannot tell the parts were as bad as they were.

Give it a try, you might be surprised at how well it straightens out!

 

In fact, this build will be in an upcoming issue of MCM.

I'm sorry, but when I spend over $40.00 for a kit, I expect to be able to build it without the hassle of trying to make their poor quality parts fit together.

I don't expect any kit to be perfect, but the warpage problem is something that can be corrected, but Moebius doesn't seem interested in correcting it. This is not the first Moebius kit that I've bought with warped parts, but it will be the last.

[1972coronet]

1 hour ago, RichCostello said:

I'm sorry, but when I spend over $40.00 for a kit, I expect to be able to build it without the hassle of trying to make their poor quality parts fit together.

Exact menudo. No excuses for newly-tooled kits to have any warpage! Look at the ERTL-come-AMT International 4070A: 100% new tooling (albeit, based on scanning an original. mint, untouched ERTL original), and is as close to perfect as anything I've built in a long time (the AMT Nova Wagon is in that class, too). 
No warped components.
No appreciable flaws (I admit that I'm not crazy about some of the sprue mounting-points - some are right at the male alignment pins) 

Monogram had kits with severe warpage issues back in the mid-late 1980s (the 1986 Monte Carlo SS comes to mind). This gave them a bad reputation -- but the malady (sped-up production lines led to "hot" runners/bodies being packaged; no cool-off period) was rectified in short order.
What's Moebius' excuse?

[mikemodeler]

6 hours ago, 1972coronet said:

Thanks much for your perspective. 
My 'idea' of selling-at-a-reduced-price remaining parts has more to do with the spare parts which could be provided; a spare 360/390 and 4-speed and/or C6 trans come to mind.
Certainly, the price of the incomplete kit should reflect this -- does $15- $20 sound unreasonable? Certainly, less expensive than resin ($15-$20 for a complete, styrene Ford FE is worth it alone, IMO, versus paying that much for a comparable resin piece which may require lots of massaging). Then there's extra wheels, hubcaps, bumpers, tail gates, engine compartment components, etc., etc.
Again, less expensive than resin, and certainly more for one's money.

While great in theory and practical to boot, it just opens up a whole set of problems. Hard to believe, but there are people out there that would try to get Moebius to make them whole on a kit like that by asking for replacement parts, starting the cycle all over again! To your point though, if one was to part out the kits - engine/trans; axles/suspension; etc. then maybe it makes sense.

[1972coronet]

42 minutes ago, mikemodeler said:

Hard to believe, but there are people out there that would try to get Moebius to make them whole on a kit like that by asking for replacement parts, starting the cycle all over again!

I have certainly considered that reality, but I'd neglected to mention it. For a comparison; I worked in auto parts for years, and every so often we'd end up with 'dead stock' or obsolete stock which was doing little more than collecting dust and taking up valuable space for items which sold. The first instance that I can think of was a surplus of ATF+3, which supersedes to +4. I recommended a client who'd not only want it, but would like its discounted price (just to get rid of the stuff). 
That shop owner/operator was very happy with the discounted, outdated trans fluid.

In another instance; the store had Valvoline "green" oil (I don't remember its nomenclature) which was dead stock from Day 1. In that instance, the store manager decided to blow it out for pennies-on-the-dollar to a shop whose owner was a cheapskate and ran a questionable business model.
I protested the decision, citing just as you've mentioned, stating to the effect of, "Oh, giving that oil to [name withheld] would be a bad idea. I can guarantee that he'll return it next month, and expect full wholesale price in credit!"
The compromise was a provision stated on the invoice that the oil cases were sold "As-Is", and cannot be returned for credit.
Sure as ish, that guy sent the oil back, expecting full credit! Too bad, mother! you're not getting credit for an item which was sold as-is.

So, yeah, I see your point about selling a kit as-is to some of the clowns out there. The honest, appreciative folks will have to 'suffer' because of the ne'er-to-do-well folks.

[fairlane1320]

I have pile of various (sealed) Moebius kits that I'm afraid to open now.?

[slusher]

I have a 69 Ford Ranger I have never opened…

[tim boyd]

FWIW, I visited with the owners of one of the best hobby shops in Michigan today.  He's sold a ton of the kits, he said, and he has also asked his regular customers who've bought the kit whether they've encountered the issues that have been raised in this thread and elsewhere.  Sounds like most have not, from what he told me. 

I bought one of the kits today myself; haven't opened it yet but will do so soon.  I will check on the issues you all have mentioned and report my own experience here soon....   

TB 

mhyso 

[bobthehobbyguy]

I have a question that I hope someone in the know can answer. There are two ways for doing quality control. One is to inspect 100 percent and the other is to check a some random sample to check quality. Which process is used for model production?

[iamsuperdan]

On 9/22/2022 at 2:29 PM, fairlane1320 said:

I have pile of various (sealed) Moebius kits that I'm afraid to open now.?

It's because of issues like these warped parts that I always open a kit and check it out when I buy it. That way, if there are issues, I can request parts immediately. If I wait a few years before opening and starting it; and THEN finding warped or damaged parts, what are the odds of getting replacement parts if it's out of production?

 

[tim boyd]

22 hours ago, tim boyd said:

FWIW, I visited with the owners of one of the best hobby shops in Michigan today.  He's sold a ton of the kits, he said, and he has also asked his regular customers who've bought the kit whether they've encountered the issues that have been raised in this thread and elsewhere.  Sounds like most have not, from what he told me. 

I bought one of the kits today myself; haven't opened it yet but will do so soon.  I will check on the issues you all have mentioned and report my own experience here soon....   

TB 

OK guys, here is my report.  On the ramp back proportion, parts #419 and 420 are warped.  #419 (the bottom of the ramp truck assembly becomes properly aligned when asseembled into the tabs/slots on the two side panels.  Part #420 (the top deck of the ramp back) is notably warped along the driver's side and at the front.  I believe I will be able to rectify this by holding the part in position against the side panel with some CA++ glue in place from underneath.  Not as sure about the very front portion.  Sadly, the hood is badly warped and not usable, and i don't think hot water will be able to fix.  I will be applying for replacements for part #420 and the hood.   Best...TB  

[bobthehobbyguy]

Tim does the warpage look like look like the pieces were boxed when they were too warm?

[tim boyd]

10 hours ago, bobthehobbyguy said:

Tim does the warpage look like look like the pieces were boxed when they were too warm?

Bob....in a simple answer, exactly, yes.   And the section thickness of the ramp deck part (#420) is relatively thin for such a large part; that probably makes it more susceptible to this type of damage as well.  TB

Edited September 24, 2022 by tim boyd

[Luc Janssens]

49 minutes ago, tim boyd said:

Bob....in a simple answer, exactly, yes.   And the section thickness of the ramp deck part (#420) is relatively thin for such a large part; that probably makes it more susceptible to this type of damage as well.  TB

Too warm when packed?.....I assume the shot gets ejected from the molding machine, then goes onto some conveyer, so that the runners are cut to shape from the sprues, depending on release and box-size and put into plastic bags (bagged shots) and stored, except for the to be plated parts which have to go through an extra handling, after which all the parts including the clear shot, are reunited at the packaging line where they will be boxed together with the decals and instructions.

IMHO 3 possible culprits (read; I'm guessing here)

 

- Too short molding cycle 

- improper storage waiting for the plated parts

- packaging itself (remember the time when Racing Champions or whatever they were called, sometimes used rubber band in the packaging of model kits?)

I'm sure the folks of Pegasus are on top of it, to prevent this from happening again in the future.

Edited September 24, 2022 by Luc Janssens
added RC comment

[Dpate]

12 hours ago, tim boyd said:

OK guys, here is my report.  On the ramp back proportion, parts #419 and 420 are warped.  #419 (the bottom of the ramp truck assembly becomes properly aligned when asseembled into the tabs/slots on the two side panels.  Part #420 (the top deck of the ramp back) is notably warped along the driver's side and at the front.  I believe I will be able to rectify this by holding the part in position against the side panel with some CA++ glue in place from underneath.  Not as sure about the very front portion.  Sadly, the hood is badly warped and not usable, and i don't think hot water will be able to fix.  I will be applying for replacements for part #420 and the hood.   Best...TB  

I know the hood they sent me was still warped, but on the opposite side. So I have two hoods one warped on the left side, and one warped on the right side. The warpage is better on the replacement hood, but it’s still warped.  Haven’t built the kit yet, but I’ll probably rubber band the hood to the body, and go at it with my mini heat gun or throw it in the dehydrator @120f. 

Edited September 24, 2022 by Dpate

[iamsuperdan]

12 hours ago, tim boyd said:

OK guys, here is my report.  On the ramp back proportion, parts #419 and 420 are warped.  #419 (the bottom of the ramp truck assembly becomes properly aligned when asseembled into the tabs/slots on the two side panels.  Part #420 (the top deck of the ramp back) is notably warped along the driver's side and at the front.  I believe I will be able to rectify this by holding the part in position against the side panel with some CA++ glue in place from underneath.  Not as sure about the very front portion.  Sadly, the hood is badly warped and not usable, and i don't think hot water will be able to fix.  I will be applying for replacements for part #420 and the hood.   Best...TB  

Exactly. Mine had the same issues. Moebius sent me a new hood and floor pan, both in perfect condition. My ramp parts were all warped. I didn't realize just how badly until I started assembly. I was actually kind of shocked to see how it straightened itself out. A little CA glue does the trick. In looking at it now, one would never know there was an issue.

[Bullybeef]

Just received and opened mine last night, sigh yes all the aforementioned parts are warped but I went ahead and assembled the ramp portion, it took patience, clamps some rubber bands and a lot more patience, but it’s straight (ish) but I deal with perfectly imperfect kits a lot. My one kudo to Moebius is for the perfect tires in the kit, i wish they had included them in the 1970 4x4.

[Brian Austin]

The owner of one of my local hobby shops theorized that the kits baked in the shipping container on the way to the US.

[Dpate]

2 minutes ago, Brian Austin said:

The owner of one of my local hobby shops theorized that the kits baked in the shipping container on the way to the US.

I guess that could be possible, BUT doubt that.

[Luc Janssens]

3 hours ago, Brian Austin said:

The owner of one of my local hobby shops theorized that the kits baked in the shipping container on the way to the US.

How Containers are Loaded on a Full Container Ship - More Than Shipping

Dunno, wouldn't there be more parts be affected then, and also transport by truck cross the US in summertime, would have the same affect, no? 

Are customers in certain areas getting more warped kits than in other parts of the country?

[mikemodeler]

On 9/23/2022 at 9:26 PM, bobthehobbyguy said:

I have a question that I hope someone in the know can answer. There are two ways for doing quality control. One is to inspect 100 percent and the other is to check a some random sample to check quality. Which process is used for model production?

You are better served posing that question to model manufacturer than here on the forum. I'm afraid here you would get such a wild variety of answers by members that you might not get the real one.