Fisheyes with 2K clear

[Marc Weller]

I’ve done 3 paint jobs with House of Kolor urethane clear over Createx water based colors. All 3 have been plagued with fisheyes. I even purchased an expensive “Minnow” inline filter and my problem persists. Any recommendations out there?

[Ace-Garageguy]

Fisheyes are most often caused by surface contaminates like wax or silicone, or a basic incompatibility between the clear and the base (or contaminated air, the possibility of which you've apparently dealt with).

Can the water-base paint stand being cleaned with 70% isopropyl alcohol prior to clearing?

I've had 100% success removing fisheye-causing contaminants on all kinds of real and model paint substrates...except water-base.

If you CAN clean it, and you're subsequently fisheye-free, well, then you're OK.

If the water-base paint can't take cleaning with iso, or if it still fisheyes, you're screwed.

Edited October 19, 2022 by Ace-Garageguy
TYPO

[Scott Colmer]

I was trying to lay Splash 2K clear over Tamyia silver and got nothing but fisheyes. I tried a box for letting the silver gas out and laying on thinner coats. Nothing worked. I had to go to Tamyia clear. The only thing I could think of was the air pressure in my brush was too high. 

I've used Extreme Colors 2K over their paint and had no problems. Maybe I should use Splash 2X over Splash paints?

[Marc Weller]

Anybody have experience with fisheye eliminator additives. There are several available and at least one advertises compatibility with urethanes.

[Dpate]

I've used finish 1. gravity colors(spain), and no name brand from spray gunners.  Those 3 2K clears I've never had an issue with.

[Dave G.]

8 hours ago, Marc Weller said:

Anybody have experience with fisheye eliminator additives. There are several available and at least one advertises compatibility with urethanes.

In 1/1 I always put in a shot of fisheye eliminator and never got fish eyes or craters. The product I had was for enamels and lacquers not sure it would work in 2k. I can imagine 2k has it's own iteration. Mine was a universal product named Smoothie and it seems to me it alluded to one shot. I remember the green and white can with pump top well.. But I painted 1/1 for 35 years using this stuff in my blends, even solvent based acrylic enamel with urethane additives and hardeners. No problems with craters or fish eyes, no meaning 0.

TCP Global sells one that eliminates craters and fisheyes. Well Fisheyes end up craters which are caused by silicones and oil contamination. Straight up craters may or may not have contamination but the paint has surface tension then the rings form in the finish. Some thinners will do this in certain paints. We get the same thing in water borne acrylics and in that case flow aid or even a trace of dish soap or glycerin will end it.

Non the less, after all these words, I think if you find the right product your problem will go away.

By the way, when airbrushing Testors square bottle thinned with hardware store paint thinner I've gotten this. Mix the thinner 50/50 with Mineral Spirits then thin the paint with that combo and no problem. Or use straight Lacquer thinner to thin it, also no problem. This is a case for straight up craters more so than fisheyes. But hardware store paint thinner flows Testors out great then the disappointment comes when the craters form. LT is just right, good flow, decent flash time, no craters.

[Rick L]

Fisheye reducers do work for urethane but it’s also best to remove the source of contamination in your environment. Are you spraying in a basement with the oil burner or other machinery running? It doesn’t take much to stir up the air around you to screw up good preparation 

[Mike 1017]

Dumb question. Was there fisheye on the paint before you clear coated?                                                                                                                  Mikw

[Ace-Garageguy]

4 hours ago, Dave G. said:

In 1/1 I always put in a shot of fisheye eliminator and never got fish eyes or craters...

Yup, I've used fisheye eliminator in the past on real cars, but only as a last resort.

But since I got into thoroughly cleaning everything with iso alcohol prior to painting, I've never had a problem.

EDIT: In general though, this seems like one of those threads that reinforces the importance of testing materials from different paint systems that are NOT designed to work together on something else, BEFORE trying to paint a model.

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Ace-Garageguy

[restoman]

8 hours ago, Dave G. said:

In 1/1 I always put in a shot of fisheye eliminator and never got fish eyes or craters. The product I had was for enamels and lacquers not sure it would work in 2k. I can imagine 2k has it's own iteration. Mine was a universal product named Smoothie and it seems to me it alluded to one shot. I remember the green and white can with pump top well.. But I painted 1/1 for 35 years using this stuff in my blends, even solvent based acrylic enamel with urethane additives and hardeners. No problems with craters or fish eyes, no meaning 0.

TCP Global sells one that eliminates craters and fisheyes. Well Fisheyes end up craters which are caused by silicones and oil contamination. Straight up craters may or may not have contamination but the paint has surface tension then the rings form in the finish. Some thinners will do this in certain paints. We get the same thing in water borne acrylics and in that case flow aid or even a trace of dish soap or glycerin will end it.

Non the less, after all these words, I think if you find the right product your problem will go away.

By the way, when airbrushing Testors square bottle thinned with hardware store paint thinner I've gotten this. Mix the thinner 50/50 with Mineral Spirits then thin the paint with that combo and no problem. Or use straight Lacquer thinner to thin it, also no problem. This is a case for straight up craters more so than fisheyes. But hardware store paint thinner flows Testors out great then the disappointment comes when the craters form. LT is just right, good flow, decent flash time, no craters.

Way back around '85 or '86 I did a fair bit of customizing on a buddy's '71 Chevelle. He and another friend sprayed it themselves, doing some flame and mural work on it. They shot it in R_M Diamont base. 

After they wet-sanded the peel and flame edges, they mixed up the clear and shot it.

Oh. My. God.

Fisheyes from end end to the other. So, they loaded the 2nd coat mix with a full bottle of Smoothie.

The poor car looked like it had been sandblasted and cleared.

They brought it to me to try and do something with, but the craters were too deep and plentiful. I ended up stripping it and painting it over. 

Seems my warning to NOT wet sand parrafin-based base wasn't heeded. That was an expensive lesson.

 

Sorry to high-jack, but the "Smoothie" reference brought back some memories.