What defines Pro Touring?

[Scott Colmer]

I am a BIG fan of Pro Touring. To me it seems to be a more reasonable version of another favorite - Pro Street. The question is - What does to be a real Pro Touring car?

Here are a few of my thoughts:

Mostly stock body - any 50's and above is usually OK with the look, but not exclusive.

High output engine that does not block vision. Usually somewhere close to the stock location. Maybe some setback for better weight distribution.

Wide low profile tires front and back on large rims- but not too tall.

Modified suspension and brakes.

Reenforced chassis and a roll cage.

Mostly stock interior with upgrades. Paddle shifters are cool.

Did I miss anything?

Scott

[Joe Handley]

I am a BIG fan of Pro Touring. To me it seems to be a more reasonable version of another favorite - Pro Street. The question is - What does to be a real Pro Touring car?

Here are a few of my thoughts:

Mostly stock body - any 50's and above is usually OK with the look, but not exclusive.

High output engine that does not block vision. Usually somewhere close to the stock location. Maybe some setback for better weight distribution.

Wide low profile tires front and back on large rims- but not too tall.

Modified suspension and brakes.

Reenforced chassis and a roll cage.

Mostly stock interior with upgrades. Paddle shifters are cool.

Did I miss anything?

Scott

Seems some of them are just Pro Streeters with a stock type interior and huge low profiles tires and airbags to let them lay'em out on the lawn, other will have full on suspension and other related mods to let them corner and generally behave more like the racecar look they're going for. Personally if I were to build one, I'd go for the later, but I prefer cars that'll take a corner "at speed" than just look like they can.

[Nick F40]

this could be opening a big can of worms, or maybe Pandora's box

in my opinion true Pro Touring cars can do it all and are built with that intention. they are fast, comfortable, can handle very well and have the "look" of say a vintage Trans Am car mixed with a BTCC, DTM or JTCC racecar.

then you have the Pro Touring "look" cars or the posers. big rims, big brakes and big stereo's on stock worn out suspension and poorly tuned engines kind of things.

Dave

Ding ding!!

Dale Watt's LMP '31, that's my kind of Pro Touring.

[Captain Obvious]

I would also say that some pro-touring cars also have modern engines (think crate engines, or the ubiquitous GM LSX engines) and interiors upgraded with bucket seats with much more pronounced bolstering, such as Recaro or Corbeau-type seats.

Look at the Foose "Overhaulin'" cars, the cars of Steve Strope, or Troy Trepanier...that's what I think of when I hear "pro-touring".

[E St. Kruiser50]

Hi Scott

Good topic

I'm including a pic of one of the first and most famous of the "PRO-TOURING CIRCUIT"

This is a die cast of the car by JOHNNY LIGHTENING.

It was called PANDEMONIUM and was a '69 Camaro RS

The engine was nearly 600 inches and nearly 700 horsepower and a six speed trans. A buddy of mine has owned this car since nearly new, and when he drove down my street people came out of their houses to see what they heard. Serious horsepower makes serious noise.

It's a completely Rotisseried and restored car. It was mini-tubbed, lowered, and given the best engine, suspension and brakes money can buy.

The charcoal all leather interior with Reccaro buckets and plush mercedes carpet and special headliner and sound system, has every convienance. Every inch of the car was finished to perfection, top, bottom, inside and out, for ultimate driving pleasure and power, straight line or cornering, this car handles.

Even the electronic ignition allows the driver to start the car from anywhere outside the car.

Edited June 2, 2009 by Treehugger Dave

[Hizoot]

From the Zoot's dictionary,

A pro touring car evolved from pro street but with the idea that these cars should be more streetable & comfortable over long disatances..! Soooooo what's on your mind now..? Does it include ribs & lots of tinney bolt heads???

Hizoot

[Scott Colmer]

LOL! Hmmmm I was thinkn' more along the line of stitches in belt patches. Von Seeetch, Two Steech Threee steeches.

Scott

[roadhawg]

Seems some of them are just Pro Streeters with a stock type interior and huge low profiles tires and airbags to let them lay'em out on the lawn..........

I've always thought airbags were for "sissies".....what good is it to "look" low if you not gonna drive it that way?

[LOBBS]

I've always thought airbags were for "sissies".....what good is it to "look" low if you not gonna drive it that way?

On one of the pro-touring forums there was coverage of a track day held by Air-Ride suspensions. They were thrashing some of their house cars and putting to shame, on the track, many with "steel" suspension setups. Air bag setups have come a long way in the last decade to where there is virtually no difference performance-wise and you have the added benefits of adjusting for a more comfortable ride.

I've always thought of pro-touring as what the engineers of the 60's would have built if they somehow had access to new millenium technologies. The classic sheetmetal of the 60s-early 70s with the equivalent handling, braking, comfort and livibility of today's best performance machines. The big wheels aren't the definition they are a necessity to clear the larger brakes, taller spindles and lower profile tires that come with improving the performance of early iron. A cage, racing seats, EFI, overdrive trannies, etc aren't necessarily required. The spirit of the movement, in my opinion, has always been to infuse the classic designs with do-it-all performance.

Edited June 3, 2009 by LOBBS

[Nick F40]

airbags are cool, you get a pretty nice ride and it's adjustable. some like to air 'em up and down and some don't. the cool thing here is that you can have different settings for different purposes. want to profile with it down low, you are there, need to clear a speed bump or a driveway, air it up and you are over it. got that perfect setting for open track events, you got that too. hydraulics are similar but don't offer the same type of adjustability or ride quality.

an example of a "factory" pro touring car? the BMW M5

this is what a Pro Touring car should be able to do, everything the M5 does, and then some

Dave

Exactly, you said it. Airbags had definetly come a long way, they are refined now.

[Hizoot]

LOL! Hmmmm I was thinkn' more along the line of stitches in belt patches. Von Seeetch, Two Steech Threee steeches.

Scott

If it involves stitches & medical tape, I like it already... ..!

Hizoot :

Edited June 3, 2009 by Hizoot

[Joe Handley]

To be honest, I kinda prefered Popular Hot Rodding's "G-Machine" builds over the "Pro-Touring" "look" that Hot Rod was pushing at one time. The G-Machines seemed to be more realisitic types of vehicles since they were the kind that could be driven to work, the grocery store, the race track, then go out and give the best the world has a run for it's money, then drive home. Where pro Touring were sometimes Pro-Streeters with huge rims, or as was previously eluded to, a wore out car with airbags and fancy paint.

[BigGary]

To be honest, I kinda prefered Popular Hot Rodding's "G-Machine" builds over the "Pro-Touring" "look" that Hot Rod was pushing at one time. The G-Machines seemed to be more realisitic types of vehicles since they were the kind that could be driven to work, the grocery store, the race track, then go out and give the best the world has a run for it's money, then drive home. Where pro Touring were sometimes Pro-Streeters with huge rims, or as was previously eluded to, a wore out car with airbags and fancy paint.

A true pro touring car would NEVER have airbags. Pro-touring is about handling, not about being low.

Gary

[MikeMc]

A true pro touring car would NEVER have airbags. Pro-touring is about handling, not about being low.

Gary

If the bags are done correctly and the right sway bars added, a '69 chevelle will keep up with late model Vettes......

[MikeMc]

in my opinion true Pro Touring cars can do it all and are built with that intention. they are fast, comfortable, can handle very well and have the "look" of say a vintage Trans Am car mixed with a BTCC, DTM or JTCC racecar.

Dave

I think that says it all............

[Marc @ MPC Motorsports]

A true pro touring car would NEVER have airbags. Pro-touring is about handling, not about being low.

Gary

That used to be the case, but not anymore.

Go to Air Ride Technologies website for the latest in air suspension technology. And for Pro Touring in scale, click on my Fotki link down in my signature.

Marc

[Joe Handley]

Found these the other day

G-Machine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYlkyWOtArg

Pro-Touring

I seriously think a decently maintained, well driven Jeep Cherokee could show those Pro-Touring cars how to run that course

Edited June 24, 2009 by Joe Handley

[FujimiLover]

I've always thought airbags were for "sissies".....what good is it to "look" low if you not gonna drive it that way?

Fun topic! I prefer coil-over suspension's that can be adjusted for ride-hight and dampness. Some can even be adjusted with dials on the dashboard!

Pro Touring, not sure what defies that either. Are we talking American version, or European class? I think even the Japanese have their own version as well.

What about DTM, SCCA, and other such European styles? BTCC for example is another one?

Mostly stock-looking Honda Accords, BMW's, Acura's, et'c, with simple wings, mild-skirt body kits, big wheels filling up the fender-gap, lowered, stripped out interiors, racing seats, et'c.

[FujimiLover]

Are we talking about real racing cars, or street cars that have a theme? Real racing cars would certainly have a stripped out interior, street car you'd want all the comforts available. If you have a daily-driver/race-car, I'd keep most of the comfort, but at least add the racing elements such as Recaro-type seats, roll-cage, et'c. This goes for all type's of racing/street car theme's.

One of my many, many, oh so many dream cars, is to have a street-legal daily-driver replica of the 98-99 I think it is, the Peugoet 206 WRC rally car. Here is how I would do it.

Start with a stock Pug 206 car. Get the best of the best WRC replica body kit, big 18 inch alloy wheels from TWS or O.Z. Racing that replicates the ones the WRC uses, get a good set of springs/shocks lowering kit suspension upgrade. Keep all the comforts of the interior but add Recaro, Sparco, or similar sport seats, you don't want actual racing buckets as they'd be uncomfortable especially for long-distance driving. Tune the engine, get a nice exhaust system that closely sounds like the WRC cars, hopefully without braking the law's DB-level requirements. Get a nice Momo steering wheel, knob, et'c interior enhancements.

I'd keep the body white, no racing graphics, no sponsorship decals, add carbon-fiber elements here and there. Keep it simple, clean, and neat. Yet, still have an awesome looking WRC replica for every day street-use.

Sorry if I've gone a tad off topic here, but seems to me we're talking about how to create a certain look? Or did I mis-read this thread completely?

Anyway, that's enough of my rambling on.

[Guest Davkin]

Start with a stock Pug 206 car. Get the best of the best WRC replica body kit, big 18 inch alloy wheels

That sounds more like a Tuner than Pro Touring to me.

As I remember it through my subscriptions to Hot Rod and Car Craft magazines at the time, Pro Touring started out basically as taking an old American body style and updating it to modern performance standards in terms of handling and comfort. G-machine to me is the same concept but taken to an extreme where the car is more race car than street car.

David

[Marc @ MPC Motorsports]

, , and here's something to think about. , , ,

The red early '70's Camaro is the earliest example I can remember of a "pro touring" style car. IIRC it had a full Trans Am [the race serise, not the Pontiac for you younger lot. LOL] style suspension and engine full roll cage etc. along with modern [at the time] wheels and low profile tires. IIRC one of the terms used to describe them back then was "canyon carver" as cars like this would be associated with street racing in and around the canyons of southern California.

Exactly what you'd concider a "pro touring" car today.

This cover is the Febuary 1981 issue

"Pro Touring" has been around for a LOT longer than most people realise.

Steve, I no longer have my old collection of 1:1 car mags, but I remember in the 1972-74 range when guys started running Mulholland Drive in SoCal in cars called "Cafe Racers", soon to be followed with the "IMSA-look" cars of the mid-late 1970's. All precursors to the Pro Touring/G Machine movement.

[Joe Handley]

Steve, I no longer have my old collection of 1:1 car mags, but I remember in the 1972-74 range when guys started running Mulholland Drive in SoCal in cars called "Cafe Racers", soon to be followed with the "IMSA-look" cars of the mid-late 1970's. All precursors to the Pro Touring/G Machine movement.

In some ways, couldn't the moonshine cars really be considered the predecessors to these and rally cars, they had to alot of the same things, just sneakier

talking about Jeep Cherokee's and pro touring, how about the SRT version? factory pro touring!

pro touring is full of "air bagged" rides and it's very much a part of the package, especially these days.

Dave

I wouldn't mind doing a Cherokee up as a cross between one of the SCCA Comanche and SRT Grand Cherokee, but keeping the 4wd, solid axles, and I-6