the testor's johan reissues

[62rebel]

i know that the old sox&martin cuda, pro street comet and s/c rambler were done but did the AMX coupe get done also?

[Ken]

The Dragon Lady AMX was re-issued by testors. I believe that it was called a pro-street AMX. Came with white metal wheels and some photo-etch bits. I have one at home, but I am at work right now so I can't give you the kit number.

[62rebel]

i can't recall if the dragon lady was a more detailed kit or just the AMX kit with pro stock extras; i imagine the repop with white metal wheels was more expensive and thereby harder to find/buy? i'm impressed by the scale fidelity and accuracy of the EXTERIOR of JoHan kits per se; was always hoping to be able to improve the chassis of their annual-based kits.

[Ken]

If you have the Cuda, then you kind of know what you are in for. The kit is an excellent late sixties pro-stock kit. Mine is out in the shed so I can't give you a run down of what is inside. If I remember correctly, which most likely I won't, the kit is an great starting point for a decent replica. Some one else will have to chime in on what is actually in the kit.

[Don Sikora II]

The Drag-On-Lady AMX has a shortened chassis from the Javelin and Javelin/AMX Trans Am racer kits that Jo-Han did....no molded in exhaust like the stock kit, but the front suspension and rear axle are molded in. It also has a separate stock style gas tank. The engine is a mismatch of early/late AMC V-8 parts...Jo-Han never did a totally correct late AMC V-8, they all share at least some parts with the 327 originally tooled for the 66 Marlin annual. Like all re-issue AMX kits the interior bucket is from the 1970 with the 1968 style dash. The body is typically Jo-Han nicely done though.

[Casey]

On 3/21/2007 at 11:47 AM, Ken said:

The Dragon Lady AMX was re-issued by testors. I believe that it was called a pro-street AMX. Came with white metal wheels and some photo-etch bits.

The Hobby Shop Only (HSO) series predated the later series kits which to my knowledge didn't have any special name associated with them:

 

HSO '70 Olds 442:

 

Glossy white box reissue from 1999:

[Mark]

The Testors-boxed AMX and SC/Rambler include photoetch emblems in addition to the metal wheels.  A small fret of parts, but still nice to have.  Okey Spaulding's Johan company has offered a more elaborate PE set for the AMX kit; reasonably priced too.  Quality is comparable to MCG's sets.  I bought a couple of them from him at NNL East earlier this year.  He mentioned doing some PE for the SC/Rambler kit; I hope he gets it done. 

[Mike Chernecki]

Whatever happened to these handful of kits that Testors re-issued? Are they lost like the rest of the Johan  tooling?

[garagepunk66]

17 hours ago, Casey said:

The Hobby Shop Only (HSO) series predated the later series kits which to my knowledge didn't have any special name associated with them:

 

HSO '70 Olds 442:

 

Glossy white box reissue from 1999:

I never knew that the Cutlass was in the HSO series as well.

[Force]

The tooling for these kits dissappeared after the last HSO run, these kits were supposed to be reissued by Testors again some years ago but they couldn't find the tooling wich I think is very strange.
Don't they know who did the molding for them the last time around?
I think it's sad because the tooling for these kits were the only usable tools from Jo-Han and maybe a few more...and if they are gone there will be no more.

[Luc Janssens]

1 hour ago, Force said:

The tooling for these kits dissappeared after the last HSO run, these kits were supposed to be reissued by Testors again some years ago but they couldn't find the tooling wich I think is very strange.
Don't they know who did the molding for them the last time around?
I think it's sad because the tooling for these kits were the only usable tools from Jo-Han and maybe a few more...and if they are gone there will be no more.

it's a hornet's nest, I'm sure the minute some entity admits they have the tooling, they will get a not so nice mail from a lawyer.

Anything Jo-Han is toxic, one is better off, tooling up new kits of the very same subject, if viable...so stuff like B-Body Plymouths, etc...

Just my 2 cents

Edited December 21, 2018 by Luc Janssens

[Force]

Yeah, I'm sure Okey Spaulding would like to have his tooling back as he bought the old Jo-Han assets, Testors only leased the tooling from Jo-Han X-El but never returned them.
But anyone tooling up new kits of the same subjects as the Jo-Han kits...naah, that will not likely happen in a foreseeable future.

Edited December 22, 2018 by Force

[Sledsel]

Don't forget the Rambler

[Jim N]

Anything can be taken care of if enough cash trades hands.  If Testor's still has the molds, then there likely isn't enough profit in a production run to payoff the owner of the assets and then meet their own ROI requirements.

[Dave Darby]

I have a gut feeling Testors never had the molds. They may have just packaged them and distributed them much like AMT did with Johan stuff back in the early 70s. Testors also branded the old IMC 48 Ford kits.  But... ya never know,  maybe somewhere off in a dark corner in Rockford, Illinois....

[MrObsessive]

6 minutes ago, Dave Darby said:

 Testors also branded the old IMC 48 Ford kits.  But... ya never know,  maybe somewhere off in a dark corner in Rockford, Illinois....

Yup! And the Ford GT40's, the Cougar II's and the Indy car which name escapes me at the moment.

[Mark]

I don't believe Testors did much, if any, actual manufacturing of model kits.  In most (if not all) cases, they purchased bagged kits in bulk, then packaged them in their own box with their own instruction and decal sheets.  That's how they handled the Fujimi Enthusiast Series kits they sold.  I've got a couple of the reboxed Jo-Han kits, I could swear one of them has "produced for Testors by SeVille Enterprises" on the box or instruction sheet.

I don't think Okey got anywhere near all of the items that were supposed to have been included in the Jo-Han deal.  It's too bad, Jo-Han did some fantastic work over the years and so little of it remains in any condition.  

The ex-IMC '48 Fords and VW Beetle were last sold by Union.  Those tools may have been shipped overseas and then mislaid.  Lindberg would probably have reissued those kits at some point, had they known where the tools were and retrieved them. 

[dimaxion]

On 12/21/2018 at 2:24 PM, Force said:

The tooling for these kits dissappeared after the last HSO run, these kits were supposed to be reissued by Testors again some years ago but they couldn't find the tooling wich I think is very strange.
Don't they know who did the molding for them the last time around?
I think it's sad because the tooling for these kits were the only usable tools from Jo-Han and maybe a few more...and if they are gone there will be no more.

I am so sorry to say . These were Made in China . The Tooling seems to get "lost there" . SOP doing Business with that Nation . I've read accounts about this for years now . They seem to be unable to make the Berillium  Steel required form superior injection molds . Plus the cost factor . Melting down and reusing V/S making New Steel .  Cheaper Products are made through lower costs . Consumers don't know how these Manufacturing Costs are reduced as a Rule .  I'm not sure of the Spelling of the particular name of this Steel . Thanx .. 

[Casey]

12 minutes ago, dimaxion said:

I am so sorry to say . These were Made in China . The Tooling seems to get "lost there"

Let's stick to facts and not to opinions on other nations, please.

Does anyone have an image of a Testor's HSO box they could share? It should be printed somewhere on the box where the kit was manufactured, and the 1999 issue in the glossy white Testors boxes, which, IIRC, came before the HSO series of kits, was clearly made in the U.S.:

On 12/30/2018 at 3:05 PM, Mark said:

I could swear one of them has "produced for Testors by SeVille Enterprises" on the box or instruction sheet.

The above image of the Testors box is hard to read, but Mark nailed it:

"Manufactured under license exclusively for The Testor Corp. by SeVille Enterprises.Inc."

That seems to lend a lot of credence to the idea that Testors repackaged an already produced product, rather than contracting a mold facility to produce the kits. Knowing what we know about SeVille Enterprises state of affairs in that era, it seems not only reasonable, but highly likely.

Unfortunately, that leaves things even less settled regarding what might've become of the molds for the '69 SC/Rambler '69 AMX, '70 Olds 442, '71 'Cuda, and Mercury Comet Pro Stock kits. Did SeVille actually produce the kits after the lawsuit with JO-HAN was over, meaning SeVille had possession of the molds and was able to create product from these five molds? Or were these merely existing kits, produced during the grey period when SeVille used the JO-HAN boxes with "SeVille Enterprises" added?

[Force]

On 2019-01-02 at 5:21 PM, Casey said:

Does anyone have an image of a Testor's HSO box they could share? It should be printed somewhere on the box where the kit was manufactured, and the 1999 issue in the glossy white Testors boxes, which, IIRC, came before the HSO series of kits, was clearly made in the U.S.:

I have some HSO kits and it says "Printed and Made in USA" on the bottom of the box...nothing about China mentioned anywhere...and nothing on the instructions.
It says Model Master on the instructions and Testors on the box, I don't think Testors molded the kits themselves so they must have had someone to do it for them...they may have got so much  of these kits from SeVille so it was enough to issue these HSO kits wich was the last seen of them.
I bought a 71 'Cuda kit in a Pro Street box from Okey Spaulding after he had taken over so there must have been some kits over from the SeVille deal....but Testors was to reissue these kits after the HSO run but the molds was gone.

[SteveG]

Ernie Petit told me on several occasions that he was sure he got those Johan tools from Seville and moved them to a Chinese Vendor when he was with RPM/Testors.  Later when he was with Lindberg he said acquired the rights to all of the Testors Plastic kits with the intention of running those old Johan tools again.  After that point he says he couldn't locate the tooling. He tried find them again when we worked together on the stillborn IMC project.  You would think there would be some paper trail if that what happened.  

Personally I don't think they will ever turn up again, I'm betting they were scrapped at some point.  If they did by some miracle,  AMT could probably make a claim for them as they acquired all of Lindberg which includes the Testors kits. 

-Steve

[Tom Geiger]

On 12/30/2018 at 4:05 PM, Mark said:

I don't think Okey got anywhere near all of the items that were supposed to have been included in the Jo-Han deal.  It's too bad, Jo-Han did some fantastic work over the years and so little of it remains in any condition.  

On 12/21/2018 at 7:12 PM, Force said:

Yeah, I'm sure Okey Spaulding would like to have his tooling back as he bought the old Jo-Han assets, Testors only leased the tooling from Jo-Han X-El but never returned them.
 

The big question is... what exactly did Okey buy?   It's been said that he bought Johan-- lock stock and barrel.  I spoke with a person who was at the Seville bankruptcy auction, who said all he purchased was a lot that included misc tooling, and a lot of parts.

It's never been fully explored exactly what tooling he had.  We know he had the '59 Rambler wagon and the simple version of the Chrysler Turbine car since he released these as kits.  It's been said both ways, that he had the tooling for the '68 Plymouth police car since he released this as a kit. Some people said he was selling kits he assembled from the parts inventory.  I'd surmise that he may have had the tooling since both the Rambler and the police car had that greenish tinted glass. 

After that, Okey sent a fund raising email to a lot of people in the hobby, stating that an entity had his tooling and he needed to raise money to get it back.  I can only figure that whoever did the contract run of kits for him was holding the tooling on a workman's lien because they hadn't been paid.  Same tooling was later shopped on the market.  Samples of the Rambler wagon and Turbine car were seen in a Moebius display at a trade show.  Dave Burket, Model King, talked about doing a run of the Rambler wagon a few years ago but never produced them.

Today, Okey goes to a number of shows as Johan, and mainly is selling a wide variety of parts from that hoard. 

 

 

[Mark]

1 hour ago, Tom Geiger said:

The big question is... what exactly did Okey buy?   It's been said that he bought Johan-- lock stock and barrel.  I spoke with a person who was at the Seville bankruptcy auction, who said all he purchased was a lot that included misc tooling, and a lot of parts.

It's never been fully explored exactly what tooling he had.  We know he had the '59 Rambler wagon and the simple version of the Chrysler Turbine car since he released these as kits.  It's been said both ways, that he had the tooling for the '68 Plymouth police car since he released this as a kit. Some people said he was selling kits he assembled from the parts inventory.  I'd surmise that he may have had the tooling since both the Rambler and the police car had that greenish tinted glass. 

After that, Okey sent a fund raising email to a lot of people in the hobby, stating that an entity had his tooling and he needed to raise money to get it back.  I can only figure that whoever did the contract run of kits for him was holding the tooling on a workman's lien because they hadn't been paid.  Same tooling was later shopped on the market.  Samples of the Rambler wagon and Turbine car were seen in a Moebius display at a trade show.  Dave Burket, Model King, talked about doing a run of the Rambler wagon a few years ago but never produced them.

Today, Okey goes to a number of shows as Johan, and mainly is selling a wide variety of parts from that hoard. 

 

 

Just my opinion, but I don't think Okey got everything he was promised when he made the purchase.  The police car kits he sold were not new production, they were assembled from parts molded previously.  All he had was green tinted clear shots; he had the clear glass vacuformed for those kits.  The Rambler wagons and snap Turbine cars were newly manufactured, but he may have used windows already on hand for the Rambler.  I've heard rumors of one or two other complete tools that he did get, but supposedly he didn't get a lot of what was supposed to have been part of the deal.  I'm not privy to any of that though, so perhaps it's best to let more involved parties speak if they wish to do so.

[Luc Janssens]

2 hours ago, Tom Geiger said:

The big question is... what exactly did Okey buy?   It's been said that he bought Johan-- lock stock and barrel.  I spoke with a person who was at the Seville bankruptcy auction, who said all he purchased was a lot that included misc tooling, and a lot of parts.

1

Makes sense, cuz for years a seller on ebay is unloading all sort of Jo-Han artifacts, items like old stock decals, left-over production parts, box-art paintings, and ditto models, I think even wooden bucks, but my mind could be playing tricks on me.

Another question is, if Okey has the rights for the use of the Jo-Han name and trade dress, also does the latter include the copyright on past model kit designs too?

[Casey]

4 hours ago, Tom Geiger said:

The big question is... what exactly did Okey buy?

It seems like only he knows, and he's not interested in letting anyone know, which is completely his choice and business to do or not do.

2 hours ago, Luc Janssens said:

Makes sense, cuz for years a seller on ebay is unloading all sort of Jo-Han artifacts, items like old stock decals, left-over production parts, box-art paintings, and ditto models, I think even wooden bucks, but my mind could be playing tricks on me.

There was a seller in Romeo, MI selling original JO-HAN artwork, but who knows who it was or why and/or how they acquired what they did. I'm just glad some of it survived and (hopefully) got into the hands of those who will protect, share, and enjoy it. I'm 99% sure these printed boxes were that seller's items:

Edited January 4, 2019 by Casey