Dumbest Question Ever: Weathering Pigments?

[clovis]

I am returning to the hobby after years of being away.

I have a strong interest in weathering models. My last model turned out fairly well, considering it was a first attempt at weathering, but I have lots to learn.

My main question is: How are weathering pigments affixed to the model?

I have watched 1,000 YouTube videos, and everyone assumes that the builder already knows how to affix the pigments.

One builder did use diluted white glue, but other than that, I am not finding much.

Are we supposed to seal those pigments with a sealer once they are applied, like dull coat?

Sorry to ask dumb questions!!!!

Edited June 5, 2014 by clovis

[GasPunkAlley]

Hi Clovis,

I built a wagaming tank and I used Dullcote and I lost half of the mud affect I applied, so in short no. The pigments are ground too fine and will fade.

It depends on the desired affect. For light weathering for rust stains, dust and mild amount of dirt the powders are the last element applied to the model and no fixatives are used. If you apply Testors Dullcote, it will blow out the affects and the colors will fade. For heavier amounts applied you can wet the surface (which was previously sealed with a clear coat) with rubbing alcohol. The alcohol will act as a binder. You can layer and build up crusty textures this way. MIG and AK interactive have acrylic binders to make thicker mud pastes to get into wheel wells, treads and tracks.

What brand of powders do you plan on using? Each brand has a different level of how fine the particles are ground too. The finer ( and more costly they are) the better the pigments stay on the surface.

[JunkPile]

Not a dum question. And a good answer too

[clovis]

Thank you for the replies!

I'd love to use AK/Mig, but I can't find them around here. One shop, which I happen to dislike very much, had two individual bottles of AK, and they are marked $12 each!!

I am toying with using an art chalk set I picked up at a thrift store.

I would love to add grimy black on a firewall, for instance, to simulate years of oil leaking. Would also like to use the same black on an exhaust pipe. Thoughts?

[jwrass]

Jeff,

There is never a Dumb question!!!!!

There are many ways to weather and highlight, I will share what I do. I personally don't think there is a right or wrong way, I find practice and experimentation go a long way!

My first step is to lay down some clear on the subject and let it dry, I do this as a barrier, if I don't like the effects I can wipe if off and not ruin the project

I use Prismacolor Nupastels and Prismacolor Colored Pencils, Really anything that will work to get the effect. With the products I use they do have a oily feel to them and can create fish eyes if not sealed properly before final topcoat I will expain that after how I apply effects.

With the Pastels and Pencils I sand some of the material of into a small pile of powder, with the texture of the products I use you don't have to use any type of adhesion vehicle (like glue) to get them to stick to the substrate, they stick just fine without them.

For application I use Brushes, Qtips, Cotton Balls and Pads, Fingers ( the dogs tail lol ) really it's up to you, Imagination is the Mother of Invention. the Pencils I mentioned are very soft you can use them directly on the piece, by sharpening or dulling the pencil you can vary your detail.

Once done I put a series of light coats (usually two) of artists fixative (I use Blair # 110 or Krylon #1306) or a intercoat clear. The key here is light coats, just enough to seal the effect and to create a barrier for your final top coat to prevent afore mentioned fish eyes. I have never had a paint failure applying the fixatives before the final topcoat.

I have used these products as a wash (although I don't do many washes) and have thinned them with mineral spirts with good results.

I hope this helps!!!! jwrass

[clovis]

James,

Thank you so much!!!!

I played with some chalk and it didn't want to stick to the painted parts of the model...and what very little that did stick came/fell off very soon afterwards.

Are the pigments supposed to be a dusting that is applied, and then can't be handled afterwards??

Also, when you make a wash, is it like making a wash with paint, or is it like having thinner with particles in it? In other words, does the chalk dissolve in the thinner?

Edited June 5, 2014 by clovis

[Harry P.]

Jeff, I suggest you send Virgil Suarez (forum name Dr. Cranky) a PM. He's been weathering models for years and he can give you a lot of good information.

[GasPunkAlley]

With most models, handling is considered a No-No. Also the powders will not stick to well to a gloss finish. There is a difference in the quality of art pastels and powdered pigments. The big difference is that the pastels have a binder added to make the sticks. The binder unfortunately does not help the powder stick to the model... Once again the alcohol as a pre-treated surface will keep the chalk in place and should allow for the texture to show through.

[GasPunkAlley]

Oh yah, the art pastel sets tend to have nice bright colors, you may want to mix a few tones together to mute the dirt and rusty colors. For oils I would mix 50% dark grey, 25% umber and 25% black to make a grimey oil and add white as needed. Mix it with some thinner to make a wash. Apply it in the area to be stained and then with a clean but moist brush (with thinner) draw the glop down as gravity will show how the grime will drip.

[clovis]

Jeff, I suggest you send Virgil Suarez (forum name Dr. Cranky) a PM. He's been weathering models for years and he can give you a lot of good information.

I think I've watched 98% of his videos, and have learned an amazing amount from those videos. I also bought his book, and the latest AK book that features his work.

Maybe I missed it somewhere...but I don't recall seeing him use anything to affix powders.

I tell ya all, I am a bit mystified by the powders...maybe I am making this harder than what it is...maybe I am just too dumb to understand. My wife will agree with that!

[jwrass]

Jeff, Ok stop with the dumb stuff!!! Harry makes a great point Dr Cranky is a great source and has a great youtube channel with many tutorials.

Rod makes some great points! the powders do need tooth to stick to and if you touch the effect before you protect it all your hard work will be on your fingers

jwrass

[JollySipper]

When we did anything with pastel chalks in art class, we would spray hair spray over it (aerosol, not the spritz kind)...

Do you guys think that it would help in this situation?

[English Jules]

i use hairspray. I am doing a AMT dodge van at the moment, to be a rusty old run around. I aint put the pics on a photo share yet. but if anyone is on FB they can see the whole build process here https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10154139972875571.1073741889.857305570&type=1

[jwrass]

Fixative is for the purpose of Sealing Art Work that has been done in Marker, Pastels, Chalk, Colored Pencils etc. I won't list the contents as there is two much to type, however looking at the chemical make up they all look to be compatible with styrene. If you must know google blairs web site. All I know about hair spray is my mother used to use it