NASCAR vs other race series

[sjordan2]

I love all racing, especially NASCAR, but I always wonder why there aren't ways for them to adapt to winding road courses other than oval tracks, such as today's Elkhart 200, and carry on in the rain. All other race series seem to be able to deal with those issues, such as Le Mans, F1, Indycar. NASCAR would be far more interesting under the circumstances the other race series face. I understand the dangers created by the incredible speeds and specialized car set-ups, but it seems that only NASCAR races get shut down this way. There must be a way for NASCAR teams and drivers to adapt to different racing circumstances.

Edited June 21, 2014 by sjordan2

[ranma]

If I remember correctly Nascar tried the rain tires, although the tires worked the winshield when it rained was the issue. Wiper's would be a issue for aerodynamics. basically you'd have to have special cars for "rain races". Nascar has road courses that they race on such as sear's point and walkins glen.

Edited June 21, 2014 by ranma

[Draggon]

I think the question was "other than ovals". Today's nationwide is interesting. Course too dry for rain tires, yet to wet for slicks? What the.....SO, since they started on slicks, if it begins to rain, will they red flag it until it gets really wet? I just dont get this. I was thinking the bumper-car thing that goes on in NASCAR would be infinitely compounded if the drivers had to deal with drastically changing conditions, but most arent that limited in ablity. Perhaps the powers that be have the answer.

I think it would be great fun to just put 'em all out there and see what happens.

Edited June 21, 2014 by Draggon

[sjordan2]

So far, this is the cleanest and safest NASCAR road race I've seen. Much more entertaining and a better driver / team test than oval racing. Hope it keeps up.

Edited June 21, 2014 by sjordan2

[Art Anderson]

And, back in, I believe, 1956, NASCAR did run Elkhart Lake. They also ran at Riverside.

Art

[Draggon]

Great finish today.

[The70judgeman]

Back when NASCAR(Nextel Cup at the time I think) went to Japan(a road course) for 2-3 years, they ran rain or shine...and it did rain one year. They did have "rain" tires. Also, they had to add a windshield wiper and a brake light to the cars...per Japan rules.

[935k3]

Here is an interesting video that shows what conditions in some series that drivers will drive in. This was at night from last years 24hrs of Nurburgring. Regardless of this argument you have a appreciate what these guys do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAvN0EzEacU

[rel14]

Nascar ? I'll stick to dirt,,,,

[Danno]

Yesterday's Nationwide race at Road America was terrific . . . and proof it can be done in the NASCAR formats.

[checkmate]

Our V8 series out here runs in rain, hail or shine. If you've ever attended or watched Bathurst you can get 4 seasons in a day up there, sunny one minute, hailing the next, fine 10 minutes later. It makes for great racing and excellent viewing.

Here's Glenn Setons drive in the wet in 1987, brilliant car control.

Around the 1:18 mark he aquaplanes at around 250kph and hangs onto it and the following lap is even more entertaining from the 2:30 mark

And I always get a laugh out of watching Darrell Waltrip's reaction to the Bathurst circuit. Funny guy.

[espo]

Years ago I worked for Union Oil in southern Cal. at the Colton Distribution Center in Colton Cal. One of my jobs was to work at the fueling station at Riverside Raceway. As I remember they never raced any series in the rain.

[sjordan2]

Yesterday's Nationwide race at Road America was terrific . . . and proof it can be done in the NASCAR formats.

I agree. And more entertaining than oval racing, at least to me. Also enjoyed Sunday's Sprint Cup race at the Sonoma road circuit. Carl Edwards won, due in part to owner Jack Roush having set him up with a road racing coach to hone his skills.

[lordairgtar]

Part of NASCAR racing's excitement is from seeing three or four cars go at high speeds side by side. This is not something that works well on most road courses from the (NASCAR) fan's point of view. I watched a bit of the Elkhart race (Been there, drove on it) and it seemed these drivers were not used to a track that narrow (as most road courses are, they resemble two lane highways) and did not get the speeds seen on a super speedway. Drivers at Bathurst are acclimated to it and you can see in Waltrip's facial expressions that that is true. Love Aussie racing.

[Joe Handley]

I agree. And more entertaining than oval racing, at least to me. Also enjoyed Sunday's Sprint Cup race at the Sonoma road circuit. Carl Edwards won, due in part to owner Jack Roush having set him up with a road racing coach to hone his skills.

Edwards may have also done some practicing on his own time too, games like Forza on the XBox do give you the chance to put a lot of hours of time on a track without having to go to the location to drive the real track

[sjordan2]

Edwards may have also done some practicing on his own time too, games like Forza on the XBox do give you the chance to put a lot of hours of time on a track without having to go to the location to drive the real track

I censored myself on this one.

[martinfan5]

Back when NASCAR(Nextel Cup at the time I think) went to Japan(a road course) for 2-3 years, they ran rain or shine...and it did rain one year. They did have "rain" tires. Also, they had to add a windshield wiper and a brake light to the cars...per Japan rules.

That was when the series was still branded by Winston, and that was back in the late 90's. The track was Suzuka(the short course) and they raced their in 1996/97, the following year they went to Motegi and ran the oval

They only had one year I believe, and that was the first trip where rain was an issue, and that was only for practice and qualifying, the race itself was ran under clear-ish skys, but you have to look at this way, NASCAR had no choice but to race in the rain is need be, this wasn't a race that could just postpone, race teams had to send the cars over two months ahead time I think, from a logistics standpoint, it was a all or nothing event .

http://youtu.be/KzVm4RZTNak

Edited June 24, 2014 by martinfan5

[martinfan5]

[Art Anderson]

NASCAR has run road courses since the 1950's--Road America for a couple of years, and then of course, the long-running "Dan Gurney Grand Prix"-NASCAR at Riverside. Certainly Watkins Glen and Sonoma have been on the docket for what, at least 30 years now?

However, it's wise, I think, to consider NASCAR's core fan base: I believe that the sheer bulk of them still are very much oval track race fans--so needless to say, the Stockers are gonna go where the fans will be in the stands (or tuned in on TV).

This country, unlike anyplace in Europe or the UK, saw auto racing start on oval dirt tracks for one very simple reason: Virtually every State Fair Grounds had one, and certainly in the Midwest, the East Coast and down south, nearly every county fair had an oval track--in much of the country those were harness racing events, with a few flat-saddle events thrown in. On the other hand, overseas such a plentiful supply of oval tracks didn't exist at the start of the automobile age--so it became a matter of blocking off a circuit made up of otherwise public roads (pretty easily done in 1900-era Europe and the UK, given the stratified class system very much in place back then. And yet, the first purpose-built high-banked paved oval race track to be built was in England--Brooklands, which ran until the onset of the Second World War. Brooklands was built several years before the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, which opened in 1909.

Yes, there were attempts to copy the European pattern, block off country roads for a race course, and there were even some "point-point" open road races run decades ago--but public pressure was against that, along with little way for the promoters of such events to charge admission to race fans so they could recoup their losses.

Something to consider re: NASCAR fans in the eastern part of the US, when Indianapolis staged the premiere Brickyard 400, there were a lot of fans who showed up, and went away somewhat disappointed, as they could not see all the way around that track, unlike say, Daytona, Talladega, Charlotte, etc.

So, I suspect NASCAR is in a bit of a quandary there: Either try and win over more converts to stock car racing by sheduling more road races (and risk turning off a large part of a pretty loyal audience, or go where the fans seem to want to be, at oval tracks. I suspect that will be a bit of a delicate balancing act for years to come.

Art

[Joe Handley]

I censored myself on this one.

Why is that?

[martinfan5]

Why is that?

Yeah, sort of curious as well, for the time being anyways

[bbowser]

Yesterday's Nationwide race at Road America was terrific . . . and proof it can be done in the NASCAR formats.

That was a great race, one of the best I've seen on a road course! It's exciting to see them go into a corner 2 or 3 wide, bumping and banging in a manner that open wheel cars can't. And the rain equalized the field as none of the drivers are really prepared.

[Longbox55]

Virtually every State Fair Grounds had one, and certainly in the Midwest, the East Coast and down south, nearly every county fair had an oval track--in much of the country those were harness racing events, with a few flat-saddle events thrown in.

Exactly. In Downstate Illinois, we even still have a few tracks that not only have a dirt stock car track, but also are still running harness racing as well. Farmer City comes to mind, with the harness track on the inside if the stock car track.

[Thatswhatshesaid]

Edwards may have also done some practicing on his own time too, games like Forza on the XBox do give you the chance to put a lot of hours of time on a track without having to go to the location to drive the real track

This could very well be true. Dale Jr. used a NASCAR video game back in the day to learn shift points at Pocono.

[Thatswhatshesaid]

I think NASCAR could really put some excitement back in the series by running some road course. How many cookie cutter 1.5 mile ovals do they have now? Thats part of their snooze factor.